sundowns 1500 vs kicker 1500

[JimJ 11]

This was only from one pair of amps, the others were very close.

http://www.carstereos.org/gallery/showimag...=4115&c=188 - the battery bank, plus a 60A rapid charger was the power supply for those tests.

Let's see some Z1/Z1A results

[audio-neon 34]

From a logistics standpoint its not a fair test. You are comparing roughly a thousand dollars of amplifiers to a 1600+ dollar amplifier. The z1 was built by DD to be a massive low voltage, highly efficient amplifier. It is an underrated 3kw amplifier which had been benched to do well over 4kw. Would the Sundown's hold their own against a DD z1, yes. Would they produce more power, depending on the voltage and impedance level. The Sundown saz-1500d's should produce roughly the same power as the DD z1.

Why as a street A competitor would you choose sundown over DD,

= Better customer service

= Rock solid amps that love low impedances

= Virtually indestructible product

= Repairs won't take 6 months to a year.

The point is DD amps while able to produce quite a bit of power are just not reliable. From a consumer standpoint, if I were to buy a 1600 dollar amplifier and had to wait 6 months for a repair. I would be pissed. DD amps are very finicky about voltage and impedance. And all though the z1 was "designed for factory charging systems" there is no possible way to run a z1 off of a factory charging system without dropping in voltage and the amp saying good bye.

I used to be a DD fanatic. Guess where my first DD amp is, sitting in my room as a paper weight after fighting with DD and still not recieving and RA number almost a year later at this point.

My Sundown amp has seen 10.9 volts and has seen nearly 20 volts and it is still there. I have had issues with my sundown product (soft start noise) that Jacob was returning my emails about at 7 am on Sunday morning. So the choice is yours, do you want to spend money on an established company with countless problems or would you rather spend your money on a rock solid product that is underrated, and backed by an industry leading warranty.

Edited June 13, 2007 by audio-neon

[TRZ 0]

Same power? The Z1A does 5KW@1ohm. What is the name of your shop TRZ?

z1a is a completely different amp and theres no way 2 strapped 1500ds will do more power

I said it would be around the same power not more powerful. I know those amps very well your forgetting I'm a dealer for them ,and I sell them and install them.I have not actually tested the 1500 strapped. I'm simply using the test results off this forum. which I would hope to be somewhat accurate.

Z1's or Z1a's? Testing against Z1's would be pointless since they don't have near the power of a Z1a.

Well I know someone locally with sundown amps, and someone with z1s.

My shop is Tremorz Auto Sound it's located in NC check under dealer zip 28677. Now what's your credentials you played with one amp maybe ? or just read some blown up post on soundpressure forum?because I can honestly say that forum and it's addm. are full of sh&* .If you think you will produce 5000 watts@ 1 ohm at 13.8 even 14.4 volts "where it was suppose to be for factory charging systems" you are mistaken. Those amps are not that eff. You can get it at 15/16 volts.I know several people that will change their amps to sundown shortly from DD..

As I said before the z1a is a beast and with the proper voltage and ohm load they will have an advantage but I am simply going off the numbers tested and posted on this forum for (2) saz1500 strapped. I 'm also well aware of what the Z1A were built for. I will test 2 saz strapped shortly for myself.

If the Z1A is sooooo gooooood how come your running SAZ 1500's in your ride, riddle me this????????????????? Regardless of what you paid for them ,In comps it's all about the win.And if I thought that I could win with DD over sundown I would without a doubt run DD amps that's a no brainer. But yet you run saZ 1500.

Now DD subs that's a whole different story ,those thing demolish all that stands in their way! I don't even stock DD amps anymore because of problems and warranty issues.

[Corey 0]

From a logistics standpoint its not a fair test. You are comparing roughly a thousand dollars of amplifiers to a 1600+ dollar amplifier. The z1 was built by DD to be a massive low voltage, highly efficient amplifier. It is an underrated 3kw amplifier which had been benched to do well over 4kw. Would the Sundown's hold their own against a DD z1, yes. Would they produce more power, depending on the voltage and impedance level. The Sundown saz-1500d's should produce roughly the same power as the DD z1.

Why as a street A competitor would you choose sundown over DD,

= Better customer service

= Rock solid amps that love low impedances

= Virtually indestructible product

= Repairs won't take 6 months to a year.

The point is DD amps while able to produce quite a bit of power are just not reliable. From a consumer standpoint, if I were to buy a 1600 dollar amplifier and had to wait 6 months for a repair. I would be pissed. DD amps are very finicky about voltage and impedance. And all though the z1 was "designed for factory charging systems" there is no possible way to run a z1 off of a factory charging system without dropping in voltage and the amp saying good bye.

I used to be a DD fanatic. Guess where my first DD amp is, sitting in my room as a paper weight after fighting with DD and still not recieving and RA number almost a year later at this point.

My Sundown amp has seen 10.9 volts and has seen nearly 20 volts and it is still there. I have had issues with my sundown product (soft start noise) that Jacob was returning my emails about at 7 am on Sunday morning. So the choice is yours, do you want to spend money on an established company with countless problems or would you rather spend your money on a rock solid product that is underrated, and backed by an industry leading warranty.

Well we are talking about 2 amps vs 1, now a street A competitor would rather have 2 z1s than 2 1500Ds. But the 3000Ds are a whole different story.

[Smartass 0]

Lets not forget that the DD amps are mainly SPL one note wonders, this coming from even people that own them. The Sundown amps are also very musical. Most have been using for SPL but at the end of the day can be used for SQ or LSQ all day long.

Edited June 14, 2007 by Smartass.bz

[theabunai 3]

I seen how sundown amps perform, i seen how their customer service is, i seen how they handle their warranties..... i've seen enough to know that if i were in your shoes, i would get a sundown...

Edited June 14, 2007 by theabunai

[platnum accord 0]

im going sundown hands down. hehe.

jacob is an awsome guy and i have sent him emails with no topic related to car ausio and he still responds.

[Smartass 0]

^^^ 100% agreee, its awsome to be able to deal with your sales guy and owner of the company 1 on 1. I like to call Sundown an Old School type car audio company. Before all the internet and marketing and company shares and blah blah blah you could talk to the company owners and get a feel for what they are all about. Warranty issues are never an issue with Jacob. Taken care of straight away. The porduct even reminds me of the old school gear solid rated at 12v no bull chit max power rating and so on. I use to be a die hard long time supporter of USAMPS and sold them for years. As companies get to big to talk to there supporters and customers alot is lost in faith. As for performance, IMO there is no compairision between a Kicker 1500 and a SAZ1500. And these things take a beating. Are they the cheapest amps.....No are they worth every penny......for sure with out a doubt. Don't listen to people that have never even touched the product and bash because the whole west coast in Canada is drinking the DD koolaid. DD is strong out there as the distributor is also out there. They make great product but im not taking out a mortgage for an amp or subs. 75% of all car audio enthusiests own houses and have families and life to pay for as well. If you try the product no doubt you will love it. I have been dealing with this hate on for sometime now and most of my Sundown customers have the "I dont give two craps about what people say or think" mentality there is a couple of big players in the works in the Canadian SPL scene that may be on the Sundown train shortly. So expect to see big things and for the attitude to flip shortly.

I will even go out on a limb and say that if you purchase one from us as you are Canadian, if your not happy send it back and I will refund you. Thats how convinced I am that you will no doubt love it.

Cheers bro

[DevilDriver 28]

I blow a damned gasket every time I see someone post on Canadian Car Audio about the Sundown products. Those Alberta and BC guys are just ridiculous and illogical.

On the topic of the two amps that are being compared, there really is no comparison to be made. I do like Kicker and some of their reps are fantastic guys (Tracy Focht comes to mind), but let's break things down a bit.

SAZ-1500D is less expensive.

SAZ-1500D has a longer warranty.

SAZ-1500D can handle much lower loads (ZX1500.1 "can" go below 2 ohms but only in very ideal situations, whereas SAZ-1500D can get under 1 ohm pretty easily)

SAZ-1500D can easily be repaired and replaced.

SAZ-1500D has better, more easily accessed support.

It seems like an easy choice to me.

[Corey 0]

^^^ 100% agreee, its awsome to be able to deal with your sales guy and owner of the company 1 on 1. I like to call Sundown an Old School type car audio company. Before all the internet and marketing and company shares and blah blah blah you could talk to the company owners and get a feel for what they are all about. Warranty issues are never an issue with Jacob. Taken care of straight away. The porduct even reminds me of the old school gear solid rated at 12v no bull chit max power rating and so on. I use to be a die hard long time supporter of USAMPS and sold them for years. As companies get to big to talk to there supporters and customers alot is lost in faith. As for performance, IMO there is no compairision between a Kicker 1500 and a SAZ1500. And these things take a beating. Are they the cheapest amps.....No are they worth every penny......for sure with out a doubt. Don't listen to people that have never even touched the product and bash because the whole west coast in Canada is drinking the DD koolaid. DD is strong out there as the distributor is also out there. They make great product but im not taking out a mortgage for an amp or subs. 75% of all car audio enthusiests own houses and have families and life to pay for as well. If you try the product no doubt you will love it. I have been dealing with this hate on for sometime now and most of my Sundown customers have the "I dont give two craps about what people say or think" mentality there is a couple of big players in the works in the Canadian SPL scene that may be on the Sundown train shortly. So expect to see big things and for the attitude to flip shortly.

I will even go out on a limb and say that if you purchase one from us as you are Canadian, if your not happy send it back and I will refund you. Thats how convinced I am that you will no doubt love it.

Cheers bro

Theres only 3 people that I can think of that actually run DD amps out here. I wouldn't say the whole west coast is "drinking the DD koolaid".

[Lord Baccus 1]

ill chime in for what its worth !!!

i have a friend that is running the SAZ1500d @ 0.5ohm sence he got it and for months on end now he has had NOT 1 Problem...

( Nuff Said )

the only reason i got the Massive p3000.1 is i got a Hella Deal on it !

[Wagonized 0]

I blow a damned gasket every time I see someone post on Canadian Car Audio about the Sundown products. Those Alberta and BC guys are just ridiculous and illogical.

ridiculous and illogical? the test numbers posted for the sundown 1500d were done so by someone on THEIR payroll. Similar to how the DD Z1 puts out 6000 rms on soundpressure.com. Except morons actually believe it because the sundown amp is a lot more affordable.

A strapped pair of 1500d's has been tested to be 2.5db below a z1. And generally the z1s are known to put out a real world wattage in the 2000-3000 watt range depending on voltage drop, box rise etc. So in REALITY which amp is better dollar per watt?

Sundown amps might be decent for beginners but I dont understand what their claim to fame is about running at 0.5 ohm daily. There are probably 100 other amps in the world that can do this no problem. And make more power.

If you want to buy sundown go ahead....but dont pick up a lump of chit and try to tell people its gold.

[audio-neon 34]

I blow a damned gasket every time I see someone post on Canadian Car Audio about the Sundown products. Those Alberta and BC guys are just ridiculous and illogical.

ridiculous and illogical? the test numbers posted for the sundown 1500d were done so by someone on THEIR payroll. Similar to how the DD Z1 puts out 6000 rms on soundpressure.com. Except morons actually believe it because the sundown amp is a lot more affordable.

A strapped pair of 1500d's has been tested to be 2.5db below a z1. And generally the z1s are known to put out a real world wattage in the 2000-3000 watt range depending on voltage drop, box rise etc. So in REALITY which amp is better dollar per watt?

Sundown amps might be decent for beginners but I dont understand what their claim to fame is about running at 0.5 ohm daily. There are probably 100 other amps in the world that can do this no problem. And make more power.

If you want to buy sundown go ahead....but dont pick up a lump of chit and try to tell people its gold.

That is quite hilarious considering that I am not on the sundown payroll, And my baby 1500w amp benched 1721.43 watts rms on 12.8 volts. Granted that this is one of the amplifiers and only at 1 ohm, but strapping a pair and running .5 ohms per amp will produce higher numbers. It is funny because In the northeast, their are next to none in people running DD amps at spl comps. I know for a fact that there are people that have run their saz-1500d's at .175 ohms. Can you do that with a DD z1 and a 18v power supply, aint gonna happen.

DD still hasn't repaired my DD M1 and they don't intend to yet.

[sundownz 197]

I blow a damned gasket every time I see someone post on Canadian Car Audio about the Sundown products. Those Alberta and BC guys are just ridiculous and illogical.

ridiculous and illogical? the test numbers posted for the sundown 1500d were done so by someone on THEIR payroll. Similar to how the DD Z1 puts out 6000 rms on soundpressure.com. Except morons actually believe it because the sundown amp is a lot more affordable.

A strapped pair of 1500d's has been tested to be 2.5db below a z1. And generally the z1s are known to put out a real world wattage in the 2000-3000 watt range depending on voltage drop, box rise etc. So in REALITY which amp is better dollar per watt?

Sundown amps might be decent for beginners but I dont understand what their claim to fame is about running at 0.5 ohm daily. There are probably 100 other amps in the world that can do this no problem. And make more power.

If you want to buy sundown go ahead....but dont pick up a lump of chit and try to tell people its gold.

Neither Loyd nor Sean is on the Sundown payroll. Both of them purchased their amplifiers and are not and were not paid by me to do any testing. Testing was done of their own accord. I have no clue where the rumor that they work for me came from.

Who tested the 1500Ds vs the Z1? I don't know about that test nor have I seen it posted until you mentioned it. Link would be nice.

I suppose you are from the Canadian Car Audio forum where they love to hate on Sundown with little to no facts. Look around and you will be seeing good numbers from Sundown guys in the lanes. There already are several guys in the high 150s and I posted as such on the Canadian forum... some guys put the results down since they weren't "DB Drag" but were MECA, nSPL, etc. Sure... DD has more records, and they should! They are a bigger company that has been around longer and have more people running their gear... that is a no brainer. Anyhow... whether you think the product is good or not has no bearing on the reality that it is a fine product and I have a slew of satisfied customers who have tested their amps themselves and made up their minds.

[Corey 0]

Lets not forget that the DD amps are mainly SPL one note wonders, this coming from even people that own them. The Sundown amps are also very musical. Most have been using for SPL but at the end of the day can be used for SQ or LSQ all day long.

What is LSQ anyways, either your system is SPL or SQ.

[sundownz 197]

I'm really tired of people hating with ridiculous and unfounded arguments...

Okay... here it is... clamp meter numbers with VIDEO. I just did this in between my last post and this post.

49.3 volts

45.3 amps

2233 Watts

With 14.4 volts rest dropping to as low as ~11.5 volts.

What you see is my test bench... 50 amp Pyramid power supply, Kinetik 2400, Duralast 1000CA battery, 2x SI Mags all in parallel @ 0.6 ohms measured DCR at the end of the speaker wire. Fluke AC current meter used for output voltage and current, Sears DMM used to show power supply voltage. Calculated impedance rise of 1.08 ohms @ 55 Hz.

I can do the test for you again a hundred times and get within 5% of that. I was doing it earlier today when testing some prototypes I got vs. the SAZ-1500D.

And yes, a clamp meter test like this one isn't the "best" or "accurate" way to do it (apparant power vs. real power)... but it's what most enthusiasts do so it's easy to compare numbers with other folks online or at shows, etc.

I made it fast so the video would be easy to download... but if anyone has doubts I can take photos of any part of the setup, even video any part of the setup. Suffice to say everything is spot on. I use the same test setup for everything... amp repairs, testing protos, etc... not rigged for anything.

VIDEO:

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/CIMG1519.AVI

[ILuvJDM 0]

*edited by sundownz*

*no need to quote the whole text block*

[sundownz 197]

*edited by sundownz*

*no need to quote the whole text block*

Yes? Is that for a question? Or... what?

[mrray13 30]

I blow a damned gasket every time I see someone post on Canadian Car Audio about the Sundown products. Those Alberta and BC guys are just ridiculous and illogical.

ridiculous and illogical? the test numbers posted for the sundown 1500d were done so by someone on THEIR payroll. Similar to how the DD Z1 puts out 6000 rms on soundpressure.com. Except morons actually believe it because the sundown amp is a lot more affordable.

A strapped pair of 1500d's has been tested to be 2.5db below a z1. And generally the z1s are known to put out a real world wattage in the 2000-3000 watt range depending on voltage drop, box rise etc. So in REALITY which amp is better dollar per watt?

Sundown amps might be decent for beginners but I dont understand what their claim to fame is about running at 0.5 ohm daily. There are probably 100 other amps in the world that can do this no problem. And make more power.

If you want to buy sundown go ahead....but dont pick up a lump of chit and try to tell people its gold.

numbers, links, video....noone here is jsut about talk. provide proof, or shut up. two people have posted either pics or vids of the sundown porduct doing it's thing. where is this z1 beating the strapped 1500s?

speaking of what you know nothing about, and or rumors, will only get your e-ass rung through a ringer. the man has spoken and provided proof. what do you have?

wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[JimJ 11]

the test numbers posted for the sundown 1500d were done so by someone on THEIR payroll.

Man, I wish I was on somebody's payroll...then maybe I'd have my setup done sooner!

[theabunai 3]

ridiculous and illogical? the test numbers posted for the sundown 1500d were done so by someone on THEIR payroll.

Neither Loyd nor Sean is on the Sundown payroll. Both of them purchased their amplifiers and are not and were not paid by me to do any testing. Testing was done of their own accord. I have no clue where the rumor that they work for me came from.

Wagonized OWNED lol

Similar to how the DD Z1 puts out 6000 rms on soundpressure.com. Except morons actually believe it because the sundown amp is a lot more affordable.

VIDEO: http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/CIMG1519.AVI

Wagonized OWNED again lol

I see a partern forming here LOL

[Smartass 0]

^^^ 100% agreee, its awsome to be able to deal with your sales guy and owner of the company 1 on 1. I like to call Sundown an Old School type car audio company. Before all the internet and marketing and company shares and blah blah blah you could talk to the company owners and get a feel for what they are all about. Warranty issues are never an issue with Jacob. Taken care of straight away. The porduct even reminds me of the old school gear solid rated at 12v no bull chit max power rating and so on. I use to be a die hard long time supporter of USAMPS and sold them for years. As companies get to big to talk to there supporters and customers alot is lost in faith. As for performance, IMO there is no compairision between a Kicker 1500 and a SAZ1500. And these things take a beating. Are they the cheapest amps.....No are they worth every penny......for sure with out a doubt. Don't listen to people that have never even touched the product and bash because the whole west coast in Canada is drinking the DD koolaid. DD is strong out there as the distributor is also out there. They make great product but im not taking out a mortgage for an amp or subs. 75% of all car audio enthusiests own houses and have families and life to pay for as well. If you try the product no doubt you will love it. I have been dealing with this hate on for sometime now and most of my Sundown customers have the "I dont give two craps about what people say or think" mentality there is a couple of big players in the works in the Canadian SPL scene that may be on the Sundown train shortly. So expect to see big things and for the attitude to flip shortly.

I will even go out on a limb and say that if you purchase one from us as you are Canadian, if your not happy send it back and I will refund you. Thats how convinced I am that you will no doubt love it.

Cheers bro

Theres only 3 people that I can think of that actually run DD amps out here. I wouldn't say the whole west coast is "drinking the DD koolaid".

Well all im saying is there is a very strong DD following out there. And Wagonized is also a friend of The A Team from CCA which is a DD dealer IIRC.

[Smartass 0]

I blow a damned gasket every time I see someone post on Canadian Car Audio about the Sundown products. Those Alberta and BC guys are just ridiculous and illogical.

ridiculous and illogical? the test numbers posted for the sundown 1500d were done so by someone on THEIR payroll. Similar to how the DD Z1 puts out 6000 rms on soundpressure.com. Except morons actually believe it because the sundown amp is a lot more affordable.

A strapped pair of 1500d's has been tested to be 2.5db below a z1. And generally the z1s are known to put out a real world wattage in the 2000-3000 watt range depending on voltage drop, box rise etc. So in REALITY which amp is better dollar per watt?

Sundown amps might be decent for beginners but I dont understand what their claim to fame is about running at 0.5 ohm daily. There are probably 100 other amps in the world that can do this no problem. And make more power.

If you want to buy sundown go ahead....but dont pick up a lump of chit and try to tell people its gold.

You guys out there have already been shown tests after tests of the Sundown SAZ1500D making the power they claim and still there is disbelief? Non of the tests are done by people on payroll bottom line. Believe what you will. And for the record no one claimed 3500Wrms out of 1 Sundown amp like someone was reporting.

[ILuvJDM 0]

*edited by sundownz*

*no need to quote the whole text block*

Yes? Is that for a question? Or... what?

In other words, he got owned with your last post.

/thread haha

[Wagonized 0]

I blow a damned gasket every time I see someone post on Canadian Car Audio about the Sundown products. Those Alberta and BC guys are just ridiculous and illogical.

ridiculous and illogical? the test numbers posted for the sundown 1500d were done so by someone on THEIR payroll. Similar to how the DD Z1 puts out 6000 rms on soundpressure.com. Except morons actually believe it because the sundown amp is a lot more affordable.

A strapped pair of 1500d's has been tested to be 2.5db below a z1. And generally the z1s are known to put out a real world wattage in the 2000-3000 watt range depending on voltage drop, box rise etc. So in REALITY which amp is better dollar per watt?

Sundown amps might be decent for beginners but I dont understand what their claim to fame is about running at 0.5 ohm daily. There are probably 100 other amps in the world that can do this no problem. And make more power.

If you want to buy sundown go ahead....but dont pick up a lump of chit and try to tell people its gold.

Neither Loyd nor Sean is on the Sundown payroll. Both of them purchased their amplifiers and are not and were not paid by me to do any testing. Testing was done of their own accord. I have no clue where the rumor that they work for me came from.

Who tested the 1500Ds vs the Z1? I don't know about that test nor have I seen it posted until you mentioned it. Link would be nice.

I suppose you are from the Canadian Car Audio forum where they love to hate on Sundown with little to no facts. Look around and you will be seeing good numbers from Sundown guys in the lanes. There already are several guys in the high 150s and I posted as such on the Canadian forum... some guys put the results down since they weren't "DB Drag" but were MECA, nSPL, etc. Sure... DD has more records, and they should! They are a bigger company that has been around longer and have more people running their gear... that is a no brainer. Anyhow... whether you think the product is good or not has no bearing on the reality that it is a fine product and I have a slew of satisfied customers who have tested their amps themselves and made up their minds.

correct me if im wrong...Lloyd is or was on the caraudio.com payroll. which is or was sponsored by sundown audio?

I blow a damned gasket every time I see someone post on Canadian Car Audio about the Sundown products. Those Alberta and BC guys are just ridiculous and illogical.

ridiculous and illogical? the test numbers posted for the sundown 1500d were done so by someone on THEIR payroll. Similar to how the DD Z1 puts out 6000 rms on soundpressure.com. Except morons actually believe it because the sundown amp is a lot more affordable.

A strapped pair of 1500d's has been tested to be 2.5db below a z1. And generally the z1s are known to put out a real world wattage in the 2000-3000 watt range depending on voltage drop, box rise etc. So in REALITY which amp is better dollar per watt?

Sundown amps might be decent for beginners but I dont understand what their claim to fame is about running at 0.5 ohm daily. There are probably 100 other amps in the world that can do this no problem. And make more power.

If you want to buy sundown go ahead....but dont pick up a lump of chit and try to tell people its gold.

numbers, links, video....noone here is jsut about talk. provide proof, or shut up. two people have posted either pics or vids of the sundown porduct doing it's thing. where is this z1 beating the strapped 1500s?

speaking of what you know nothing about, and or rumors, will only get your e-ass rung through a ringer. the man has spoken and provided proof. what do you have?

wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

why would they take pics and video of a test that wasnt even close? And one that confirmed what was already 99% believe that the sundown amp doesnt put out anywhere near the power claimed. If i raced a stock vw bug against a corvette would I have to take pics and video for you to believe the corvette one?

Id be willing to test 8 sundown 1500d's against my 4 memphis 4kw amps on a limited battery system but that would be a waste of time for me because I know my score would go down. But id be sure to take countless pics and videos so you guys believed it.

The person that did the test by the way was Yuli Shumsky (sp?) from ontario canada. Hes been finals a few times now. Termlab doesnt lie....and let me tell you 2.5 db difference isnt just a couple hundred watts.