Demoed the 302s to someone

[sundownz 197]

Showed off the 302s to a friend who is running an entirely Alpine Type-R setup. He was quite impressed... I believe his exact words were, "Wow, now that is clarity." His Type-R components sound pretty good, don't get me wrong, but they most definatly weren't equal to the 302s -- and he agreed with that no arguments. The Type-R tweeter sounded somewhat shrill in comparison and the midbass capability wasn't anywhere near the 302s. And, of course, since he had no EQ you could sense the mids rolling off in his car, where that wouldn't be happening with the 302 midrange.

Steven, I need to track you down sometime you can take a listen -- you might end up wanting a set!

[Electrodynamic 2]

Wait...the 302's impressed someone? Noooo.

[allConfused 0]

this comp set is started to look pretty apealing to me, i might try and buy it just to compare it to my diy setups.

compared to the comp set above this what would you say are the weak spots of these 302's. if it has the same tweeter, and strong midbass crossable into the 65 herts region then i dont see whats worse about it lol. these thigns look awesome.

[sundownz 197]

I run the 302s at 50Hz with an 18dB slope without issue.

What about the 307s? They have a crossover box, adjustable tweeter level, and the midrange is just flat out superior -- but it's not made for off-axis install, it really needs kicks to perform well. They are also made with using a seperate midbass driver in mind.

[allConfused 0]

ahe superior midrange.

well from the couple diy comps i have made myself i could try out the 302's and if midrange aint good enough i can add one of my own with it.

with my situation i dont think i could really go wrong with them. but that midbass they have just sounds aweosme.

Edited April 14, 2004 by allConfused

[sundownz 197]

I would definatly suggest having a good amount of power for the 302s... if they have a weakness it's that they aren't the most efficient set on the market. The amp I have is capable of 200 x 2 RMS bridged... which is how I'm running it. Of course the gain structure is set so that I'll never have near that power... but I will tell you 30 x 2 RMS is not enough to do them justice.

[allConfused 0]

i always give stuff more power than it wants. you can always back off on the gains. my view is id rather have to much power and turn it down than send a clipped signal

[stangme01 0]

man you guys are crazy running your 6's down that low. When the mid is moving that much (assuming you play it at any kind of high volume) it really starts adding distortion to the mix. The less that mid moves the cleaner it plays. 80hz is PLENTY low, and I would never go lower than around 74-76hz. Just a waste if you ask me. BUT we all have our own tastes and opinions. But I think alot of experienced people will agree 50hz-60hz cutoff is not necessary with a sub in the car. Even for the biggest audiophile

[allConfused 0]

actrualy isnt it a 7 incher? and it sounds like they are saying that even crossed that low its not distorting or bottoming out. thats very cool.

how would you describe this mids sound? punchy, laidback,crisp?

[sundownz 197]

man you guys are crazy running your 6's down that low. When the mid is moving that much (assuming you play it at any kind of high volume) it really starts adding distortion to the mix. The less that mid moves the cleaner it plays. 80hz is PLENTY low, and I would never go lower than around 74-76hz. Just a waste if you ask me. BUT we all have our own tastes and opinions. But I think alot of experienced people will agree 50hz-60hz cutoff is not necessary with a sub in the car. Even for the biggest audiophile

I've played around with the crossover frequency extensively on this set and dropping it to 50Hz has done nothing but make the bass more up-front. The set remains very clear up to an unpleasantly loud volume level. Now, if you are going to absolutely jam the hell out of them then yah, an 80 Hz crossover frequency will do alot to lower IMD. This mid has really impressed me with how well it handles the low crossover frequency though... it has a VERY shallow low-end rolloff so it doesn't move *that much* to make quite a bit of low information.

How shallow is the roll-off? The response graph shows the mid being only 5 dB lower at 20 Hz than at 100 Hz. For comparsion sake lets consider the PL18WO09 from Vifa. It is 13 dB lower at 20 Hz than at 100 Hz. Something to consider...

[sundownz 197]

actrualy isnt it a 7 incher? and it sounds like they are saying that even crossed that low its not distorting or bottoming out. thats very cool.

how would you describe this mids sound? punchy, laidback,crisp?

You won't bottom out the 302 mid unless you have torn the suspension, you can't push it far enough with your hand to bottom it out.

And yes, it is a 7" midrange driver.

Describe the sound... I'm not a big fan of those type of descriptive terms. I would describe it as very accurate, and quite dynamic for a mid in this price range.

[allConfused 0]

The response graph shows the mid being only 5 dB lower at 20 Hz than at 100 Hz. For comparsion sake lets consider the PL18WO09 from Vifa. It is 13 dB lower at 20 Hz than at 100 Hz. Something to consider...

that is flat insane, there are 12 inch subs that couldnt pull that off lol.

Edited April 15, 2004 by allConfused

[Tirefryr 1,742]

Is that with the PL installed IB in the door? OR anechoic chamber? These are starting to sound very tempting with my limited time and budget anymore, DIY is getting to be a PIA!

[sundownz 197]

Is that with the PL installed IB in the door?  OR anechoic chamber?  These are starting to sound very tempting with my limited time and budget anymore, DIY is getting to be a PIA!

Both response graphs are taken in anechoic conditions, and this is generally done on a large baffle, IB, for any manufacturer (except Seas, I think they use a 1 ft^3 sealed box). It's an apples to apples comparison.

When you throw them in a car the PL will certainly start looking alot better. But you still have the fact that the 302 midbass doesn't have to work nearly as hard to do the same thing. I have tested them crossed over at 25 Hz playing the new A Perfect Circle CD... bass reproduction was most impressive -- as Nick can attest for you as well.

I'd certainly love to do some in-car measurements of the 302... once I get this semester over with I'm sure Nick and I will do just that.

The 302s certainly are not the end-all on door components... but I think anything else in their price category is in for some serious competition.

Edited April 15, 2004 by sundownz

[sundownz 197]

The response graph shows the mid being only 5 dB lower at 20 Hz than at 100 Hz. For comparsion sake lets consider the PL18WO09 from Vifa. It is 13 dB lower at 20 Hz than at 100 Hz. Something to consider...

that is flat insane, there are 12 inch subs that couldnt pull that off lol.

Don't get too carried away -- it still is just a 7" driver. Even if the subs raw response isn't nearly as good it will have FAR more output than a 7" driver with limited, in comparison, amounts of x-max.

Also keep in mind that IB is required to pull this off for the 302 mid... never, and I repeat, never... put the 302 mid in a sealed box unless you have about 4 cubes or an aperiodic membrane and about 2 cubes.

Edited April 15, 2004 by sundownz

[Electrodynamic 2]

ahe superior midrange.

well from the couple diy comps i have made myself i could try out the 302's and if midrange aint good enough i can add one of my own with it.

with my situation i dont think i could really go wrong with them. but that midbass they have just sounds aweosme.

Just to emphasize what Jacob said, it's not that 302's midrange is "ok" or "bad" in any way, but it's just that the 307's midrange is killer. The midrange on the 302's should impress everyone that listens to them. That, and for their price, I don't know of anything that even comes remotely close to them.