Input on 8's

[mrogowski 6]

Alright, Aaron has pushed me to start looking into this...

I would like to hear your input on what it is you would like to see in an 8" size. There are so many brands to chose from nowadays, from big-box companies to boutique 'internet-only' proprietorships. Some really good, some not so good.

What is it about the 8" you purchased that made you decide to get it?

Best,

Mark

[Aaron Clinton 2,372]

Well I feel the thing of the 8" sub is that is allows some people with little to near zero space to work with, to have a solid substage. What I was mentioning to Mike was that there is not much on the market in a good preforming mid priced 8". The SS RL-i8 is a very capable 8" sub, but it is out of reach $$$wise for many people or more than they want to spend.

[mrogowski 6]

Just being a bit facetious buddy..

[///M5 2,833]

It was all about small sealed volume for me. 0.4cuft on the Rli and it was easy to tuck anywhere.

I think some might actually prefer some that were a little less power hungry as well. It would make a budget setup easier in that you could easily use a 4chn with the rear two channels powering a substage. Not that big of a concern to some of us that seem to collect amps, but for someone who is starting from scratch it would be helpful. The Rli8 laughs at 300w.

[mpimm 0]

I would love to see a MAW 8. I'm very happy with my MAW 10s, 12 and 15. I would like to see an 8 with a half decent sensitivity. Hard to find. But I'm not too picky. Mainly, I would like to see an budget 8 priced similarily to the MAW line... if not part of the MAW line (hint hint). I'm guessing you are planning for a possible 8 for the high excursion line. Curious to see what you can come up with. Just hoping it's not tooooo expensive, although I'm sure whatever you come up with will be more than reasonably priced.

[Puggsley456 0]

Honestly..... overall, I dont know if there is a big enough market for 8's. I mean in the enitre car audio world in general. For home audio use definetally.

I've never been a fan of 8's.

[///M5 2,833]

Hmm, if we define sub a bit differently. The Peerless XLS 8 has been known to be the best IB midbass in a car door, albeit very upper frequency limited. There is a huge following for it. It is listed as a sub, but in application in vehicles doesn't normally get used that way. Currently it is discontinued and there is no replacement. This driver was originally marketed as a subwoofer, but in auto applications was rarely used that way. Perhaps an XLS replacement would be a good thing to look into. If you could get it to play beyond 300hz it would be another bonus as well. A lot of people would like to run a 3 way front stage but use a dome midrange which can't extend that low. If on the flipside it had a dual purpose as an 8" sub that would make it attack a couple of markets.

As for high frequency extension, this Aura is known to have a good response to 1k. Creating an 8 might really fill a niche.

http://www.madisound.com/cgi-bin/index.cgi...7818&pid=97

If you make this I will hack up my truck doors quickly to fit in a pair.

[ANeonRider 3]

I'd be dumping the Type X components, and going active 3 way if there was a Mach5 8" Depth would be an issue, so if it is possible to get it to play higher, and not be too deep, I'm sold.

I think I'm on a quest to own one of everything Mark sells... only missing the MAW-15 at this time

[Acidburn 10]

if you built a sub a lot like the old RE RE8 and priced it the way it used to be priced (or less), i think you could sell quite a few

[mrogowski 6]

Hmm.. interesting feedback thus far.

Ok, lets look at this from different perspectives.

Depth:

What would be an adequate depth that folks can live with?

Frequency Extension:

Might not be too difficult, but will take some tweaking. The MJ can go beyond 1k already and sound not bad.. for an 18..

Technology:

The XLS is a beautiful line, as are the Aura's. Them suckers are expensive tho. Are folks prepared to pay a premium price for another boutique brand?

Specs:

Small VAS sounds like the bottom line here..

Thanks guys. If you can tink of other things, don't hesitate to share...

Best,

Mark

[Ga foo 88 0]

Something like the re8 would be great, or even like the tangband 8. However, I would love to see an 8" mid that could play up to 2k. Since Im assuming your talking about subs, something fairly priced with low space requirements would be ideal, especially for the people who would order 8+ for some spl/fun set ups.

[DIYiT 0]

Unlike some of the others here, I don't see super small VAS as being the bottom line. While it is important, I see the minimum depth being the cause of greatest concern. If the driver is shallow enough, and still cheap enough, it could be used as a lower midbass driver in car doors, or used as a shallow subwoofer in homes, such as placing it beneath a bed, or behind a couch, while still being much more financially appetizing than $120 shallow mount subwoofers only meant for sealed use in cars. If you could design a shallow subwoofer, with a relatively low Fs, and specs that allow it to be used in a ported enclosure, I think you'd have a good market for small, hidden subwoofers in the home environment.

[vladd 26]

I guess this is where i differ, no real need for me to try to fit 8s in my doors. If i was going to buy 8s it'd be for the rear deck of the stratus and they'd be going IB. Or i'd be running a dozen of them in the hatch of the eclipse just to burp it(=cheap and good power handling).

[Godsmack 361]

Me......I like freak stuff..........HUGE MOTOR HIGH power handeling stiff as steel spiders and tall surround...........something that WANGS

Must be a inverted mount sub due to motor size LOL.

J

[///M5 2,833]

Depth:

What would be an adequate depth that folks can live with?

Frequency Extension:

Might not be too difficult, but will take some tweaking. The MJ can go beyond 1k already and sound not bad.. for an 18..

Technology:

The XLS is a beautiful line, as are the Aura's. Them suckers are expensive tho. Are folks prepared to pay a premium price for another boutique brand?

1) Under 4"

2) I don't think shooting for a 2 way setup will be cost effective. Even 600-800hz would be great for a 3 way though as you wouldn't be limited at all by your midrange in LFE then.

3) I apologize for bringing up expensive comparisons, but in my mind going 3 way it is sort of the competition. Obviously the Aura is too expensive and large and the XLS is discontinued so I just see a market hole there.

I would argue with the ported requirement as my problem with ported 8's is that the enclosure is smaller than the port. Optimal for in door use or a small sealed box for sub duties.

[audio-neon 34]

My personal favorite 8" driver, although not a sub-woofer is the 8" mid-bass out of a set of Hertz Space k8L components. It is like 2 inches deep, 93 db sensitivity, extremely real sounding, great frequency extension etc, etc. It weighs less than a lb, but can handle 200 watts.

So for the fun of it, i will include a picture:

[ANeonRider 3]

Depth:

What would be an adequate depth that folks can live with?

Frequency Extension:

Might not be too difficult, but will take some tweaking. The MJ can go beyond 1k already and sound not bad.. for an 18..

Technology:

The XLS is a beautiful line, as are the Aura's. Them suckers are expensive tho. Are folks prepared to pay a premium price for another boutique brand?

1) Under 4"

2) I don't think shooting for a 2 way setup will be cost effective. Even 600-800hz would be great for a 3 way though as you wouldn't be limited at all by your midrange in LFE then.

3) I apologize for bringing up expensive comparisons, but in my mind going 3 way it is sort of the competition. Obviously the Aura is too expensive and large and the XLS is discontinued so I just see a market hole there.

I would argue with the ported requirement as my problem with ported 8's is that the enclosure is smaller than the port. Optimal for in door use or a small sealed box for sub duties.

Agreed.

[DIYiT 0]

I would argue with the ported requirement as my problem with ported 8's is that the enclosure is smaller than the port. Optimal for in door use or a small sealed box for sub duties.

I guess I'm just comming at this from a different viewpoint than you... I'm more of a home audio guy, so a larger enclosure that I could flatten out behind a couch or beneath a bed would allow me to build a ported enclosure with a still reasonable port size to box ratio.

However since most people here are looking at car use, I'd say a slim mount driver that could be built into decent 3 way setup would be very enticing.

It just depends on which application you're looking at.

[Aaron Clinton 2,372]

Mark this could play into a Mach5 two way or three way set up for both home and car audio. Solid preforming components with a qulaity crossover (if needed) could do ok I think.

[///M5 2,833]

I would argue with the ported requirement as my problem with ported 8's is that the enclosure is smaller than the port. Optimal for in door use or a small sealed box for sub duties.

I guess I'm just comming at this from a different viewpoint than you... I'm more of a home audio guy, so a larger enclosure that I could flatten out behind a couch or beneath a bed would allow me to build a ported enclosure with a still reasonable port size to box ratio.

However since most people here are looking at car use, I'd say a slim mount driver that could be built into decent 3 way setup would be very enticing.

It just depends on which application you're looking at.

For me in that case, I'd use a larger driver then. Do the math and try to tune a .5cuft enclosure to 20hz with enough port area. Your box is all port. Considering that this is the case, I'd expect that as an alternative stepping up to a driver that was optimized for a larger enclosure could actually end up smaller since the port length would be shorter. Of course, I am the kind of guy that wants to move into a house that I can run 4 MJ18's mounted IB for home audio so the 8 for home audio eludes me.

edit: by no means am I trying to be antagonistic DIYiT

[Aaron Clinton 2,372]

Sean, maybe the 8 could be for front stage.

[DIYiT 0]

I would argue with the ported requirement as my problem with ported 8's is that the enclosure is smaller than the port. Optimal for in door use or a small sealed box for sub duties.

I guess I'm just coming at this from a different viewpoint than you... I'm more of a home audio guy, so a larger enclosure that I could flatten out behind a couch or beneath a bed would allow me to build a ported enclosure with a still reasonable port size to box ratio.

However since most people here are looking at car use, I'd say a slim mount driver that could be built into decent 3 way setup would be very enticing.

It just depends on which application you're looking at.

For me in that case, I'd use a larger driver then. Do the math and try to tune a .5cuft enclosure to 20hz with enough port area. Your box is all port. Considering that this is the case, I'd expect that as an alternative stepping up to a driver that was optimized for a larger enclosure could actually end up smaller since the port length would be shorter. Of course, I am the kind of guy that wants to move into a house that I can run 4 MJ18's mounted IB for home audio so the 8 for home audio eludes me.

edit: by no means am I trying to be antagonistic DIYiT

No problem, ///M5. Personally, I'm one who believes in larger drivers (4 IB'd MJ18's would be excellent), however, there have been situations where I think building a subwoofer as a present for a friend or a family member would be nice, however, I know they don't appreciate function over form like I do , so it was my chance to stick my $.02 for a home audio orriented slimline, rather than a car audio one. Maybe if a compromise was met so that the sub would work in a .5 to .75 ft^3 enclosure ported only down to 30-35 Hz to augment small bookshelf type speakers (really, does home audio really need to strive for 20 Hz with an 8" subwoofer? Bring on the 15's instead!!) with a fairly flat frequency response, but at the same time work well in a car environment, I think we would have a very versatile sub, that could attract a lot of attention.

Edited April 6, 2007 by DIYiT

[Scarenius 0]

I've only owned one pair of 8s. Almost every time I find a pair I would like to have, I run into the problem that they either lack the high end response I need, or they are simply too big for my intended design. My goal was alway a two way setup to fill in the complete musical spectrum in the front without the need for a dedicated woofer. Otherwise, most of my attempts to make an 8" sub audible in my Taurus fail miserably. So, I think if I were to look for a practical 8" woofer, it'd need to have a very small enclosure requirement, be efficient, and have a solid high end up to the 2k range.

[///M5 2,833]

Sean, maybe the 8 could be for front stage.

That is what I want them for

[Ga foo 88 0]

thatd make me happy