Indecision between FI Q Neo and FI BTL Neo

[DoozeyMontana 0]

So I’ve narrowed my choices down to the FI Q Neo 15 and the FI BTL Neo 15. My indecision is which would be best for my tastes/application. I’ve never had a system as quality as what I’m looking to get into, so I’d like to get everything right and feel satisfied with the end result. I’ve had 1 15” l7 and 2 12” l7 over the last 6 years. Both systems were adequate, however, the most recent system being the 2 12s wasn’t put together properly by the audio shop I had install and build the box for them to be housed in. Long story short; the box and wiring didn’t jive with the setup, which burnt my coils and broke the surround on both subs. They were dual 4 ohm wired to a Hifonics brx2000.1d (know I know, Hifonics is low budget garbage) with 1/0 OFC by knukoncept run from the battery and ground. There is a fancy LOC that had to be installed, because my car (2014 Impala LT 3.6l) has a headunit that can’t be removed. I forget the name of the converter, but I’ll be able to check that all out once I remove the current setup to install a new system. 

 

With this being said, I am looking to get into a good quality setup and having everything proper. I will be doing a BIG3 upgrade, replacing battery with an XS power, and replacing stock alternator with HO 250amp alternator. I am even open to adding a second XS in the trunk, which I’m assuming I may have to do if I want everything to be up to par. I will also be getting a quality amp, depending on the sub chosen, and what kind of power I will need to have for it. 

 

This will just be a daily driver setup, which will probably never see any competition type settings. While I enjoy SQ and being able to listen to any kind of music, whether it’s rap/hip hop, rock, country, dubstep/edm, I also love just being loud as hell. I am more of a lows kind of guy, in the sense that I love feeling panels flex, but I’m aware that a lot of music I listen to has notes that are probably in the higher frequencies. I have quite a bit of trunk space to sacrifice, as the box that is currently in my trunk is 40”wide 18.5”deep 19.5”high, which is roughly 7cubes before displacement. I will be purchasing a box design plan from the SSA store, as I’d like to have the box as perfect as possible for the sub that is chosen. I’m aware the Q is a sealed box setup, and the BTL can be either sealed or ported. If I go with the BTL and the ported route, I was thinking of having the tuning around 32hz. 

 

Any input/suggestions is greatly appreciated. There are probably details I’ve left out and any questions about aspects I may not be addressing with this original post, I am more than happy to try clarifying.

Edited April 5, 2018 by DoozeyMontana

[bigrank916 72]

Actually the Q can be ported or sealed. The BTL is ported only. Never heard the Q but I owned a BTL about 10 years ago and it was the best sub I'd ever had. If you like to bang pretty loud and enjoy some earth shaking lows, I'd go with a BTL.

[DoozeyMontana 0]

yes, you’re right about that, I’m not sure why I thought the Q was a sealed setup. I’ve run a bunch of numbers between various subs, which have varied between sealed suggested and ported suggested. First I started with RE XXX, then went to Orion HCCA, HDC4, DC XL, etc.. so maybe that’s where I made a mistake haha. Everything I’ve read has pointed towards the BTL, but I figured I’d inquire with people who might be familiar with either setup. I’ve seen many posts about how “x” sub pounds low end but gets muddy up top. I’ve looked at other makers like SSA, IA, and AA, which at this point just pretty much seems like it’s whoever I go with I’ll ultimately be satisfied with. Not sure what exactly swayed me to go FI, but I’ve seen nothing but positive reviews on all of them. 

I suppose my follow up question regarding the decision on which sub to choose, is what amp/power I could be looking at throwing at it. With the Q I was looking at an ampere 2200, or something else that’s got good reviews. Seeing as the BTL can handle more than 2200, I’m unsure what the next level I should be looking at. Assuming the big3, alternator, and battery upgrades is enough to supply the power, I’m sure most any amp would be able to produce rated rms. 

Once again any suggestions is appreciated!

[altoncustomtech 773]

I have a set of 12” Fi Q’s that have been treating me great for 9 years now. They still work and sound every bit as good as they did when they were brand new. 

You’re not getting hurt by either one on the quality of the product, however I would imagine that according to the intended design goals of the two drivers the Q will be smoother and better suited to an SQ system than the BTL. Not that a BTL has no business in SQ, jroadtatts ran a single 15” BTL in the Accord he built quite successfully, but that’s not to say it would be the best choice for everyone. 

[///M5 2,833]

Your post screams BTL.

[DoozeyMontana 0]

I’ve been leaning towards the BTL, from the comments I’ve received so far. Theres a few errors in the post that I should’ve proofread and double checked my facts first lol. For example the mistake of what kind of box each driver is intended for use in, as well as the misnaming of the ampere 2k amp confusing it with the scv 2200 amp haha..

So far what I’ve come up with for choices on amps is either an Orion XTR2500.1 or the Twisted Sounds 2.8k for a BTL setup. From reviews both of these amps look like they’re solid choices to power a BTL to its full potential, and I can imagine with the box design from the SSA store will help to add to that factor that much more.

Should I be expecting to add a second battery to the trunk, or is it possible to get away with a 240a mechman and a d3400 xs power up front with 2500-3000watts on the amp? I’ve never had a system that has this much power potential, so I’d like to make sure all my T’s are crossed and I’s are dotted to prevent any issues. 

As always suggestions and input are appreciated! 

[nigel 148]

It never hurts to have extra reserve on tap.  Just saying.

Will it be absolutely necessary?  Not likely, considering you're already planning on beefing up all the under hood electrical, and that your planning on running this as a daily for music which is dynamic and you won't be seeing a constant max output.  Chances are the majority of your comfort level listening will be quite a bit below max volume.

Edited April 8, 2018 by nigel

[j-roadtatts 1,129]

 The fact we're having this conversation leads me to believe the BTL would be a great candidate for your application. LOL

 I ran my BTL in a 5 cu. ft. tuned to 32hz. Going with the largest recommended size will net the smoothest response.  I did the minimum of 16 sq. in. per cubic foot, and still ended up at 6.3 ft.³ internal volume.  So be prepared for a really large enclosure. 

 The BTL treated me good on just about every kind of music. I had a sub woofer level control on the head unit, and just set the sub to sound musical at zero. When I wanted things to get violent, the knob got turned!! That is when the BTL really shined and pulled away from the pack on the low end. 

 As far as a second battery.  I would recommend going one of two ways. Either set up everything else and see how your voltage is...  or if you have the money to invest just drop it in and be done with it.  Too much power is definitely better than not enough, on so many levels. I had a 250 amp alternator, a 3400 under the hood and a 1200 in the back, and the headlights still dimmed at full tilt. But it was oh so heavenly being bathed in bass when needed. 

 My current set up is two 15" Icons in a sealed box. I think any less than that after the BTL and I would not be satisfied.  Hope that helps in your decision. 

[///M5 2,833]

16 hours ago, j-roadtatts said:

 The fact we're having this conversation leads me to believe the BTL would be a great candidate for your application. LOL

99.99% of the time that someone compares a BTL & Q, the BTL is for them.  Just because the Q is part of a misrepresented phrase that has an S in front of it sometimes confuses people into thinking the BTL is a fart only solution.  Not at all the case.  As many have proven it can sound just fine.

[DoozeyMontana 0]

At this point in time, I’m pretty sold on getting the BTL. I have a feeling from the comments I’ve received in this thread that I will certainly not be dissapointed. I’m actually looking forward to getting things in order, as I doubt I’ll be able to get all the equipment at once haha. I’m debating on the amp still, as I’ve been able to source the opportunity to get an SCV3000 now for close to $600. While I’d like to save the money by getting the Orion XTR, I’m concerned that the amp may not be as good of a choice as the TS2.8k or the SCV3000.

I’ll most likely be investing the extra little bit into the power supply, just because it sounds like the best route to get the best results. I’ve never wired a second battery before, but through my research I’ve noticed it’s pretty much just adding fuses to the wiring. One between the two batteries, and one between the second battery and amp. Some suggest to put two between the two batteries and two between the second battery and amp, but that seems a little unnecessary.. Also I’ve read multiple arguments between people in threads/on YouTube, which claim a second battery setup absolutely requires an isolator. 

Any suggestions regarding the amp selection, as well as the battery situation are greatly appreciated! 

[altoncustomtech 773]

There should always be a fuse as close to the positive terminal as possible, it doesn’t matter where that wire is going or what it’s feeding, the fuse is protecting the battery and your car/livelihood from burning to a crisp. 

If you have two batteries you really need to fuse at both of them, why you ask?  Because if you only fuse at the front battery and there’s a direct short in the middle of the wire the front fuse will blow and protect that battery but now the rear battery is sitting there still shorted. If you’re lucky the wire will burn and cut the connection before it catches anything else on fire or causes the battery to explode. A fuse is cheap insurance to protect you from ever having to experience such a problem and they definitely happen.

As for the amp, I’ve never seen a complaint about the Sundown amps, at least not one that holds any merit. Same goes for the Orion for the most part. The TS amps just seem a little too cheap to me, probably just me and a bad opinion, but it’s why I’ve never considered one in my plans or recommendations. 

[DoozeyMontana 0]

Thanks for the clarification, I understand what you’re saying, and I’m going to have to agree that a few extra $15 fuse setups is well worth saving a 20k+ investment hahaha... So assuming the amp requires anywhere from a 200-300a fuse, does that mean each fuse in the chain should be 200-300a, or would I be splitting that up between all the fuses? I mean in reality it’s probably better to use bigger rated fuses regardless of the situation, so I suppose that’s just me trying to gain a little more understanding about electrical. I notice there’s no mention of an isolator, so I imagine that must not be required for a dual battery setup? 

From the info I’ve gathered on all 3 of the amps that I’ve got my interest in, each one does well over rated power. The Orion seems to be the best power for dollar, but I just want to get quality power for a sub that deserves the best I can provide it. With all of that said, I suppose I’ll be debating between the SCV and the Orion. Either way it sounds like I’ll be in good company with one or the other. 

Edited April 9, 2018 by DoozeyMontana

[Notorious97200 339]

Get the BTL and the Sundown amp : you'll love it.

If you don't know what to choose between the Fi Q or the  Fi BTL (or BL) : the BTL is for you.

I love my BTL N2 : I've heard it on several amps, from 1500 to +3000 wats, it's loud and clear.

Honnestly, you can try an SSA Zcon too : they are fantastic.

 

 

[cowolter 0]

I've had a Q12 myself, and it is a pretty good sounding sub but it's not out-of-this-world amazing. It doesn't have any special technology in it like XBL2 or LMS or copper shorting rings or anything to lower distortion. It IS designed reasonably well, otherwise, and will compare favorably to most subwoofers on the market (most of the other speakers have nothing like XBL2 either). It's a combination of a lot of things that most people don't think about. What material is the surround, how thick is the surround, how wide and tall is it? What is the cone made of? How thick is that? What size is the voice coil? How strong is the motor? What is the Q? etc. A lot of engineering goes into matching all the different components together properly, and also the precision of building the speaker.

Honestly, I think it sounded pretty darn good with just about anything I put to it. It wasn't my favorite sounding sub in the world but never did I feel that it was bad. It has a bit more distortion than the more-expensive subs that I prefer (brands like Acoustic Elegance) which some people prefer (more distortion, I mean) in rap, but the distortion is not too excessive and it still works well for rock and such.

I wouldn't recommend it for classical music and such, but it can do rap and rock pretty well in my opinion. Personally I pumped lots of electronic music through it such as the Crystal Method.

[Tirefryr 1,742]

1 hour ago, cowolter said:

I've had a Q12 myself, and it is a pretty good sounding sub but it's not out-of-this-world amazing. It doesn't have any special technology in it like XBL2 or LMS or copper shorting rings or anything to lower distortion. It IS designed reasonably well, otherwise, and will compare favorably to most subwoofers on the market (most of the other speakers have nothing like XBL2 either). It's a combination of a lot of things that most people don't think about. What material is the surround, how thick is the surround, how wide and tall is it? What is the cone made of? How thick is that? What size is the voice coil? How strong is the motor? What is the Q? etc. A lot of engineering goes into matching all the different components together properly, and also the precision of building the speaker.

Honestly, I think it sounded pretty darn good with just about anything I put to it. It wasn't my favorite sounding sub in the world but never did I feel that it was bad. It has a bit more distortion than the more-expensive subs that I prefer (brands like Acoustic Elegance) which some people prefer (more distortion, I mean) in rap, but the distortion is not too excessive and it still works well for rock and such.

I wouldn't recommend it for classical music and such, but it can do rap and rock pretty well in my opinion. Personally I pumped lots of electronic music through it such as the Crystal Method.

DO you have a way to prove this?  I am very curious as to how a subwoofer "has a bit more distortion."