How Much Do You Throw At Your XCONs? (Daily)

[Tyrell Wilson 1]

Hey All,

 

Trying to figure out how I want to setup my daily driver and would like some input from some experts (as I am not 1).  I have 2 12" XCON D1's and 2 Orion 2500d's.

 

The Plan:

Wire each XCON in parallel to provide a .5 ohm load

The 2500d's are not strappable but they should be stable at .5 with my electrical

 

So the thing is, I did some testing on 1 of my 2500d's and was getting approximately 2200 rms on stock electrical in my friends truck (which was probably only putting out around 12V or so).  By wiring my subs down to .5 ohm's I feel that the amp will be able to supply at least 2500-3000k rms to each sub.  Would this be way too much for each 12" XCON (I don't want to blow them).  I know I could keep the gains adjusted appropriately, but just wanted to hear about others experiences with these subs.

 

2500d specs:

RMS Power @ 4 ohms

1200 watts x 1 channels

RMS Power @ 2 ohms

1700 watts x 1 channels

RMS Power @ 1 ohm

2500 watts x 1 channels

 

 

Thanks for any response/feedback

[hdrox88 142]

From what is written here, I wouldn't recommend going over the rated limit of the sub or the amp. Why are you wanting to throw so much at them? Why are you wanting to run the impedance down so low? What vehicle is this going in? What about the box? Or even electrical of said vehicle?

This is one of those situations of, "If you have to ask, you probably shouldn't." I'm not trying to be a jerk, just trying to help prevent possible equipment failure.

[frogcase2002 393]

If you watch what your doing it shouldnt be a problem but really need to be carefull.

I agree that you probably shouldnt though

Edited March 9, 2015 by frogcase2002

[altoncustomtech 773]

The small gain in power isn't worth the stress it's going to cause everything, and definitely not for a daily setup. Stick to 1 ohm per amp, you'll never be able to hear a difference and all your equipment will be much happier and last longer.

[hdrox88 142]

For what it's worth, I killed an xcon on ~1700 watts. It was my own fault, but it just shows what user error can do at rated power, let alone nearly double that.

[jcarter1885 995]

You guys didnt know running over rated power and real low ohm loads is the new hype in car audio. But like stated earlier if you have to ask then dont bother.

[Tyrell Wilson 1]

From what is written here, I wouldn't recommend going over the rated limit of the sub or the amp. Why are you wanting to throw so much at them? Why are you wanting to run the impedance down so low? What vehicle is this going in? What about the box? Or even electrical of said vehicle?

This is one of those situations of, "If you have to ask, you probably shouldn't." I'm not trying to be a jerk, just trying to help prevent possible equipment failure.

 

Well, I originally had just 1 2500d but the person whom is helping me with the install said that I should get another.  He informed me that is better to have more power on tap than is needed and typically better to have double the power that is needed for the subs in any particular amp so that the amp does not have to work as hard.  

 

I personally don't care what they are ran at as long as it is loud and clean (I think he advised running them down at .5 b/c thats the only way i could wire them in which each amp would support.)  I think i can also wire each sub to each amp at 2 ohms as well (which is 1700wrms).

 

They are going in my 2006 Honda Accord EXL Coupe v6

 

We are planning on building a box that is around 5 cu ft w/ a 8" aero port

 

Electrical:

Under hood - Kinetik 1200 (40ah)

                      Big 3 (All 0 Gauge OFC - 400 amp fuse)

                      Singer 240 Amp HO Alt

                      2 Runs of 0 Gauge OFC +

 

Back -            2 Kinetik 3800 (270ah)

                      

 

fyi - also running 16 speakers (8 mids, 8 tweets) off of 2 Orion 4002 amps

 

Hope that helps to clarify a few things.

[frogcase2002 393]

With the right enclosure you would be really surprised using just one of the amps

[hdrox88 142]

You guys didnt know running over rated power and real low ohm loads is the new hype in car audio. But like stated earlier if you have to ask then dont bother.

Heck yea man, why do you think I'm running my zcon at half ohm on a bc3500?

[Tyrell Wilson 1]

For what it's worth, I killed an xcon on ~1700 watts. It was my own fault, but it just shows what user error can do at rated power, let alone nearly double that.

 

how did you manage that?

[Tyrell Wilson 1]

I personally would not mind if I could just push 1700 rms to each sub...I don't necessarily care about it being that loud (i just like nice hard hitting bass) but also like SQ as well.

 

I tested just 1 2500d on 2 orions xcon's and it was plenty loud enough for me but my friend pushed getting the 2nd 1 so i did.  He told me that you also have to account for box rise, etc.

[hdrox88 142]

From what is written here, I wouldn't recommend going over the rated limit of the sub or the amp. Why are you wanting to throw so much at them? Why are you wanting to run the impedance down so low? What vehicle is this going in? What about the box? Or even electrical of said vehicle?

This is one of those situations of, "If you have to ask, you probably shouldn't." I'm not trying to be a jerk, just trying to help prevent possible equipment failure.

 

Well, I originally had just 1 2500d but the person whom is helping me with the install said that I should get another.  He informed me that is better to have more power on tap than is needed and typically better to have double the power that is needed for the subs in any particular amp so that the amp does not have to work as hard.  

 

I personally don't care what they are ran at as long as it is loud and clean (I think he advised running them down at .5 b/c thats the only way i could wire them in which each amp would support.)  I think i can also wire each sub to each amp at 2 ohms as well (which is 1700wrms).

 

They are going in my 2006 Honda Accord EXL Coupe v6

 

We are planning on building a box that is around 5 cu ft w/ a 8" aero port

 

Electrical:

Under hood - Kinetik 1200 (40ah)

                      Big 3 (All 0 Gauge OFC - 400 amp fuse)

                      Singer 240 Amp HO Alt

                      2 Runs of 0 Gauge OFC +

 

Back -            2 Kinetik 3800 (270ah)

                      

 

fyi - also running 16 speakers (8 mids, 8 tweets) off of 2 Orion 4002 amps

 

Hope that helps to clarify a few things.

Now we are getting somewhere. Electrical seems pretty decent for what you would like to run. Building a box on the larger side of the recommended size would allow you to use one amp and still let the subs stretch their legs. Both amps at half ohm would be hard on the alt and batteries and probably a little silly, but that's just me.

[hdrox88 142]

For what it's worth, I killed an xcon on ~1700 watts. It was my own fault, but it just shows what user error can do at rated power, let alone nearly double that.

 

how did you manage that?

Sealed box so I never smelled the coil smoking and I wasn't paying attention. Was clipping the hell out of the signal.

[frogcase2002 393]

I would worry more about getting the enclosure perfect.

[hdrox88 142]

I personally would not mind if I could just push 1700 rms to each sub...I don't necessarily care about it being that loud (i just like nice hard hitting bass) but also like SQ as well.

 

I tested just 1 2500d on 2 orions xcon's and it was plenty loud enough for me but my friend pushed getting the 2nd 1 so i did.  He told me that you also have to account for box rise, etc.

1700 watts sealed, then 1900 watts ported(2 different amps) on my single xcon 15 was pretty fun. 1 2500 on 2 12" should be nice? You should tell your friend that he gets to replace stuff when it breaks.

[Tyrell Wilson 1]

 

 

From what is written here, I wouldn't recommend going over the rated limit of the sub or the amp. Why are you wanting to throw so much at them? Why are you wanting to run the impedance down so low? What vehicle is this going in? What about the box? Or even electrical of said vehicle?

This is one of those situations of, "If you have to ask, you probably shouldn't." I'm not trying to be a jerk, just trying to help prevent possible equipment failure.

 

Well, I originally had just 1 2500d but the person whom is helping me with the install said that I should get another.  He informed me that is better to have more power on tap than is needed and typically better to have double the power that is needed for the subs in any particular amp so that the amp does not have to work as hard.  

 

I personally don't care what they are ran at as long as it is loud and clean (I think he advised running them down at .5 b/c thats the only way i could wire them in which each amp would support.)  I think i can also wire each sub to each amp at 2 ohms as well (which is 1700wrms).

 

They are going in my 2006 Honda Accord EXL Coupe v6

 

We are planning on building a box that is around 5 cu ft w/ a 8" aero port

 

Electrical:

Under hood - Kinetik 1200 (40ah)

                      Big 3 (All 0 Gauge OFC - 400 amp fuse)

                      Singer 240 Amp HO Alt

                      2 Runs of 0 Gauge OFC +

 

Back -            2 Kinetik 3800 (270ah)

                      

 

fyi - also running 16 speakers (8 mids, 8 tweets) off of 2 Orion 4002 amps

 

Hope that helps to clarify a few things.

Now we are getting somewhere. Electrical seems pretty decent for what you would like to run. Building a box on the larger side of the recommended size would allow you to use one amp and still let the subs stretch their legs. Both amps at half ohm would be hard on the alt and batteries and probably a little silly, but that's just me.

 

 

Could i potentially make the box smaller if I ran both amps?  The box will be in the trunk and forward facing (i would prefer to make it smaller if possible to keep room for a spare tire)

[Tyrell Wilson 1]

 

 

For what it's worth, I killed an xcon on ~1700 watts. It was my own fault, but it just shows what user error can do at rated power, let alone nearly double that.

 

how did you manage that?

Sealed box so I never smelled the coil smoking and I wasn't paying attention. Was clipping the hell out of the signal.

 

Yikes!

[hdrox88 142]

You could run a smaller box and more power if you were dead set on it. You likely won't see much gain in output and you will be stressing your equipment in the process. This game is full of trade-offs, just need to figure out where your priorities lie.

[Tyrell Wilson 1]

I think it may be "wiser" since I am not as experience as most to just wire each sub in series at a 2 ohm load and push 1700 rms to each.  That is still a shit ton of power and should be plenty loud.

[Tyrell Wilson 1]

Also, I am sorry but this is not my daily vehicle at all.  This is going in my "show" car that I only drive during the summer on nice weekends and occasionally on road trips to shows.

[pmureika 31]

Is this for real or did you make it up? Your friend doesn't know what he is doing! 

[Tyrell Wilson 1]

Is this for real or did you make it up? Your friend doesn't know what he is doing! 

He knows what he is doing and no it is not made up.  He does multiple "high profile" builds all of the time and has been doing this stuff for years and competes regularly.  I am just looking to get a 2nd opinion on my particular setup.

[fred57 2]

From my point of view of running the two xcon 15s with my sundown 1500d at 1 ohm compared to my crescendo 3500 at ohm , id say just run one of the 2500ds and ya you will barely hear a difference for what extra electrical its worth.

[///M5 2,833]

Well, I originally had just 1 2500d but the person whom is helping me with the install said that I should get another.  He informed me that is better to have more power on tap than is needed and typically better to have double the power that is needed for the subs in any particular amp so that the amp does not have to work as hard.

That person is an idiot, stop listening to him.

I personally would not mind if I could just push 1700 rms to each sub...I don't necessarily care about it being that loud (i just like nice hard hitting bass) but also like SQ as well.

So you like loud and peaky and something that is much less loud and flat response at the same time. Or perhaps you just don't understand either of the opposites.

Could i potentially make the box smaller if I ran both amps?  The box will be in the trunk and forward facing (i would prefer to make it smaller if possible to keep room for a spare tire)

You can but it makes no sense and won't help you at all. Back to liking the FR thing....obviously you don't.

He knows what he is doing and no it is not made up.  He does multiple "high profile" builds all of the time and has been doing this stuff for years and competes regularly.  I am just looking to get a 2nd opinion on my particular setup.

He has A LOT to learn.

Seriously, just run one amp. You never once referenced a meter in your posts so chasing less than audible sound differences is pointless. You have to double the power to hear a difference. Running a second amp won't do that for you as between reaching the thermal & mechanical limits of the driver and power compression will stop that cold in its tracks. The 2nd amp is a waste of money, don't buy it, don't use it and don't invest in the necessary electrical to add it as what you propose is literally akin to flushing money down the toilet. I would also be vary wary of any other advice said friend is giving you as obviously he is a complete noob and infatuated with all of the wrong aspects of audio. Headroom is important, but this is a sub that is going to play the very smallest of regions in the audio spectrum where your ear is super inefficient at hearing distortion or anomalies. Terrible place to spend extra money for no reason.

Put that budget you were about to waste to good use and spend it ALL on your front stage. It will make a monstrous difference.

[jcarter1885 995]

He already has 16 speakers for his mids and highs so the front stage is already taken care of.