When an alarm does no good. ATTN Central Ohio

[wannabang 13]

*ATTN:  Those that live in Central Ohio.*

 

Friday night my car was opened and trashed, but nothing was taken.  Saturday night, my car was broken into via the rear and passenger windows that were pried until cracked and pushed in.  All that was taken was my iPod and GPS, although, they did rip the sub box off of the floor it was screwed into. 

 

The suspects are 6'0"+, white males, wearing baseball caps, built, and driving a light-colored, late-model minivan.  They have vandalized and broken into more than thirty locked and unlocked vehicles sitting outside homes in neighborhoods around the Pickerington area.  I have heard that they have also struck in Dublin and map was found outside my house that designated multiple communities along I-270 with highlighter.  They pry the window with what seems like a crowbar or hammer on one side until it cracks enough that they can push through it, so as to avoid alert anyone with loud banging/shattering.  It seems as though this is a team of thieves that work in pairs since multiple neighborhoods have been hit in the local area during the same time periods.  I feel obligated to get this info out as the cops have not charged anyone, nor has the local media picked up the story.

 

Unfortunately, the car insurance company says I'll have to pay out my deductible so nothing will be covered... yay.  I have scratches, dings, broken windows, missing property, and glass in my cloth seats...

 

Pictures of the damage.

 

 

I've taken second thought at the Ace Security Laminates.

 

Take care, all, and be safe.

[shizzzon 461]

I was about to say.. then you said it.. Ace.

 

I would call them and tell them how they are doing it and see if ACE will help you with prying it out.

[Shogen 325]

wow! sorry to hear that man

[wannabang 13]

Thanks, guys.  I've mentioned Ace's laminates to a few of my modded friends and they seem to love the idea.  I can't image that it'll help as much as it does with the bat, but it wouldn't be as easy to push in once cracked.  In the end, parking in the garage is always the best bet.  I know people on other forums with a interior cabin camera that is always recording when the car is off, which seems a bit far to me.  Unfortunately, this was only the second time it's sat outside my house this summer and is the second time in 24 hours that it has been messed with.  What are the odds?

[shizzzon 461]

i cant convince myself to get a or multiple cameras because of the following-

 

Where are you going to point one for best effectiveness?  Don't know.. need several...

Ok, well nightvision cams will be $$$ especially a few of them.

 

Then, you will need a DVR system and a dedicated batt bank for this thing every night.

[Aaron Clinton 2,372]

:(

[Randal Johnson 544]

dang ...

[The enD 467]

Unfortunately, the car insurance company says I'll have to pay out my deductible so nothing will be covered.

Why?

[wannabang 13]

 

Unfortunately, the car insurance company says I'll have to pay out my deductible so nothing will be covered.

Why?

 

I have a thousand dollar deductible.  Although, I did find a clause about windshield repair, but we'll see if that counts for vandalism and the rear windshield.  

 

If you drive it daily, I would think that a rearview camera or two mounted on your dash would be fine as it's low-draw and small.  I'd put one near your glove box and one above your stereo, so as to see over the seats, too.  Night vision shouldn't matter too much since when the doors open, the lights come on.  A second battery might be necessary, though. 

 

**Update on the case:

 

They struck again in a nearby neighborhood last night, hitting one house with a camera forward facing on their house.  Caught their faces and lifted fingerprints.  Of course, this will only bust them if they have definite suspects or the thieves have priors.  The news finally picked up on the story, too.  Hopefully they'll turn up empty in their next break in and people are on the lookout.

[dem beats 1,223]

Cameras do almost nothing to stop theft. Having your belongings off the road and under a bright light and/or locked door is about the best. Dogs are good too.

Alarms are worthless unless they are so loud they cause physical pain to the people breaking into your stuff.

[jonbearsmt 919]

so tell me again why an alarm "would do no good"?

[dem beats 1,223]

Statistically it doesn't change the rate of theft, or likelihood of catching the thieves unless it actually is so powerful it slows them down.

In most property/building uses they recommend a silent allarm for many many reasons. One of them being that an alarm escalates the situation for the thieves and they have been shown to cause more property damage.

As it doesn't prevent the initial break in and almost never the theft, it makes the cost of an alarm statistically worthless.

My point isn't that you shouldn't have one, my point is that it in monetary terms it saves less than it costs usually.

Edited July 29, 2013 by dem beats

[wannabang 13]

Well, they don't exactly stop the robbery, just draw attention to it.  Also, they broke the windows, so unless you have a glass-detecting microphone that triggers the alarm, it won't go off.

 

Cameras would at least catch a face, to make them easier to identify for police to garner a conviction.  Prevention isn't always fool-proof, so the next step is to draw attention and get evidence, which is hard if thieves are breaking glass, they'll usually have gloves, so I'd think cameras are next best option. 

 

All this being said, making the glass less breakable and strengthening the edges is the best step to preventing the theft altogether.

[SPL_Man 20]

wow thats fugged up

[jonbearsmt 919]

i have proximity sensors  if you come near my car it warns, locks,. and alerts my key chain, once it warns twice it goes off.... alerting me...  then  big mad jon comes with a peace keeper.

[wannabang 13]

i have proximity sensors  if you come near my car it warns, locks,. and alerts my key chain, once it warns twice it goes off.... alerting me...  then  big mad jon comes with a peace keeper.

 

Literally made me laugh.  Does it ever happen when it warns twice because multiple people just walk by your car in the parking lot?  Does it get annoying?  I thought about it, but decided it might irritate me too much, or have me paranoid when I didn't need to be.

[EPerez 236]

Fuck those bitches!!! I hope they get caught. Good thing they got their pictures and finger prints.

[jonbearsmt 919]

i have proximity sensors  if you come near my car it warns, locks,. and alerts my key chain, once it warns twice it goes off.... alerting me...  then  big mad jon comes with a peace keeper.

 

Literally made me laugh.  Does it ever happen when it warns twice because multiple people just walk by your car in the parking lot?  Does it get annoying?  I thought about it, but decided it might irritate me too much, or have me paranoid when I didn't need to be.

you can set the sensitivity and also how wide it detects  you really have to get it dialed in  so that it does not  go off too easily .... it makes you jumpy at first but after a while you kinda learn  it, and alot of times if it warns once i wont look but if it warns twice i will... and it hardly ever goes off from 3 warns,  ... i also have dual shock sensors so.

 

 but the thing  i like the most.. i have my dialed in to warn when you walk CLOSE.. but if you cup your hards on my window to look inside it will go off right away ...

 

 i have used this system on my last 3 cars. for the last 9 years... and i have never been broken into..  

[wannabang 13]

 

i have proximity sensors  if you come near my car it warns, locks,. and alerts my key chain, once it warns twice it goes off.... alerting me...  then  big mad jon comes with a peace keeper.

 

Literally made me laugh.  Does it ever happen when it warns twice because multiple people just walk by your car in the parking lot?  Does it get annoying?  I thought about it, but decided it might irritate me too much, or have me paranoid when I didn't need to be.

you can set the sensitivity and also how wide it detects  you really have to get it dialed in  so that it does not  go off too easily .... it makes you jumpy at first but after a while you kinda learn  it, and alot of times if it warns once i wont look but if it warns twice i will... and it hardly ever goes off from 3 warns,  ... i also have dual shock sensors so.

 

 but the thing  i like the most.. i have my dialed in to warn when you walk CLOSE.. but if you cup your hards on my window to look inside it will go off right away ...

 

 i have used this system on my last 3 cars. for the last 9 years... and i have never been broken into..  

 

The cupping of the hands is a good one... except that I find myself wanting to check out others' systems just by looking in. lol  This with a Viper?  I have a Viper, and have thought about adding some options.

[jonbearsmt 919]

no i run a cheap ass Excalibur  made by omega

[muddybass 13]

I would be sitting outside with my peacekeeper waiting especially after the first night..

[dem beats 1,223]

How much does your alarm cost Jon, and how far does the remote trigger work?

Jon your car hasn't been broken into because most cars are statistically not broken into. You also take care of your belongings and are not putting yourself in a ton of shifty situations. Of course your alarm helps but it is the smallest reason it hasn't been broken into.

As for the laminate, what is the cost? And it won't stop the window from being broken, so it really isn't preventing property damage, it's just mitigating it, depending on the cost of the laminate and modifications to the car.

Prevention is all about location, perception, and deterrents. Make the risk not worth the reward for a criminal and they won't even try.

Same reason why nicer kept places are robbed less than properties that are more run down. The perceived difficulty is a lot. Lights lighting up the property do more than cameras and alarms when you look at statistics for break ins.

Relying on other people noticing the theft AFTER they break in is next to pointless because they now already have the mentality that they are under a smaller time constraint. So they will damage more of your property to extract what they wanted. They no longer need to be quiet so smash and grab time is at hand.

Most thefts are now lock breaks, and when an alarm goes off as they try to quietly bypass a lock, they break a window since it's already loud and boom they smash and grab.

[dem beats 1,223]

An alarm that goes off before someone touches the car is kind of nice, it might spook the random moron but if someone knows you have something they want, or if it's a motivated criminal(read meth head etc etc or someone with debt to bad people) noise won't stop them.

[wannabang 13]

True.  The laminate is $8/ sq.ft., or that's what I got from the thread I got it from in the Auto section.  I calculated it to be about $190 + install.  Not sure it's something I'm going to by into.  I'm going to see if Viper has something like what Jon's describing.

[shizzzon 461]

Cameras do almost nothing to stop theft. Having your belongings off the road and under a bright light and/or locked door is about the best. Dogs are good too.

Alarms are worthless unless they are so loud they cause physical pain to the people breaking into your stuff.

 

My dad's truck got broke into in his own driveway in the backyard with the gate shut with TWO motion sensor lights in the backyard.

So, no, i do not buy into the light it up argument.

 

You want physical pain?  Some people on here know what i'm about to do to my vehicle.

I don't care how illegal it is.. bill me..  

I currently have 2 130db Directed alarms on the outside of the vehicle...

Soon.. I will have an imported Siren from china rated at 160dB.  cost's $280 so we'll see how well it does. It fires in 2 different directions at once.

 

 

Statistically it doesn't change the rate of theft, or likelihood of catching the thieves unless it actually is so powerful it slows them down.

In most property/building uses they recommend a silent allarm for many many reasons. One of them being that an alarm escalates the situation for the thieves and they have been shown to cause more property damage.

As it doesn't prevent the initial break in and almost never the theft, it makes the cost of an alarm statistically worthless.

My point isn't that you shouldn't have one, my point is that it in monetary terms it saves less than it costs usually.

 

I seriously do not think you should compare building theft to vehicle theft.

There's a visual difference when it's happening.. Business theft.. nothing looks out of the ordinary unless there are 30 people there.

 

 

Well, they don't exactly stop the robbery, just draw attention to it.  Also, they broke the windows, so unless you have a glass-detecting microphone that triggers the alarm, it won't go off.

 

Cameras would at least catch a face, to make them easier to identify for police to garner a conviction.  Prevention isn't always fool-proof, so the next step is to draw attention and get evidence, which is hard if thieves are breaking glass, they'll usually have gloves, so I'd think cameras are next best option. 

 

All this being said, making the glass less breakable and strengthening the edges is the best step to preventing the theft altogether.

 

Directed makes a glass break sensor but how they pulled yours out.. i doubt it would work since it measures sound. You would need a Prox sensor.  As soon as the glass were to be moved, it would set the alarm off.

 

 

i have proximity sensors  if you come near my car it warns, locks,. and alerts my key chain, once it warns twice it goes off.... alerting me...  then  big mad jon comes with a peace keeper.

 

Literally made me laugh.  Does it ever happen when it warns twice because multiple people just walk by your car in the parking lot?  Does it get annoying?  I thought about it, but decided it might irritate me too much, or have me paranoid when I didn't need to be.

 

I will be using a custom external prox sensor that will not be tied to the actual alarm.

This custom sensor will send a trigger to a timer sensor that will send power to a "light source" warning anyone around the car that they are being watched.

 

And yes... it will physically display those words too.

 

I do not need to know when someone is close to the car but when someone is, that should be enough deterrent.

 

IF they want to hear what 2 130s and a 160 sounds like, go right ahead and play around with it.

 

 

PS- the Ace Laminate is the strongest laminate in the industry according to their motto.

 

Level 3-thickest grade for vehicles.

14mil thick

Tensile Strength- 28,000 PSI

Break Strength- 350 PSI

 

Rated for 1\8" thick glass adhesion.

 

Cost- $8\sqft

I paid $145 to have it installed on 4 doors, 2 small quarter panels and rear curved window.

 

Here is a video showing it's brutalness-

 

 

Security is all about slowing down the suspect.  That's Step 1 security.

I am looking at all angles that a NORMAL suspect would use under limited time to steal or gain access inside.

 

Window break, door picking, slim jimming, OBDII Theft, Battery kill and vehicle theft(not towing) all made near impossible within a few minute time period.

 

some of these are physically impossible such as slim jimming, door picking and OBDII theft  

 

Others like towing- go ahead and tow it.. I can track it.

 

 

I'm very crucial about security.

 

My car was broken into 5yrs ago NEXT TO A POLICE STATION.

My dad's truck recently broke into as stated above in full lighted area.

 

I don't go by general recommendations.  

 

When someone tells me if they want in, they'll get in or if they want something, they'll get it.. 

Well, that's like a statement of faith and without anything else to say.. the statement is invalid.

 

If they truly want in or get something, then what is all the ways they will do it?

That's where i attack at every angle.

 

Unless a thief has 20min+, it isn't happening.

 

I'm still working on finishing my security packages but mine is well over $2gs right now.