Loud front stage opinions (SQ guys beware, lol)

[///M5 2,833]

You CAN'T shop for mids until you have the tweets figured out. Exactly why what you have currently makes no sense together. I'm always shocked that they are an implied pairing from a manufacturer.

Figure out how to get the HLCD's in and then start thinking on mids.

[///M5 2,833]

Oh, need to have some idea of processing before shopping as well. Or at least know how far you are willing to go.

[swift 501]

There are even a couple sets for sale on DIYMA right now: ID Mini-horns & BMS Mids

Thanks I will look into it

[swift 501]

The pioneer 80prs is all the processing I plan on running. After looking in my truck putting the hlcd's should'nt be a problem

[///M5 2,833]

That'll give you 7 bands of control on the tweets covering 5 octaves which in your case is enough.

Next question is always space.

[swift 501]

There are even a couple sets for sale on DIYMA right now: ID Mini-horns & BMS Mids

Really considering grabbing these hlcd's while they are available. From research these seem like very good quality? Any reason not to? If I do I will run either single 8 or single 10's in the doors... Maybe....

[Impious 1,476]

They are good horns. The mini's don't drop as low as the full bodies but being smaller & easier to fit is the trade off there. They should still be good down to ~1200hz with a steep slope. They'll need some EQ but I believe your HU should be able to handle it, but I'm not as familiar with that unit as M5 is.

[jcarter1885 995]

Eric Stevens has his own line of HLCDs out after leaving Image Dynamics, I'm not on my computer at home to get you his contact info. Go on diyma.com forum and pm him to get a full set, horn bodies and hlcd compression drivers.

[mccleery3 166]

Eric Stevens has his own line of HLCDs out after leaving Image Dynamics, I'm not on my computer at home to get you his contact info. Go on diyma.com forum and pm him to get a full set, horn bodies and hlcd compression drivers.

Hmmmm, I'm interested in this myself.

[jcarter1885 995]

email is [email protected]

I have two models Pro $299 and Ultra $425.00. Pro is a ferrite magnet version and the Ultra Neodymium magnet, they both share the same diaphragm and phase plug. Ultra has a higher efficiency 111dB versus 109dB also higher power handling 100 watts versus 60 but this is a non issue in the car as we can never use their actual output potential without losing our hearing. Ultra has more air on the top also.

[djjdnap 78]

155db...

What is mid-bass?

[swift 501]

Ok question,

If I do get nice HLCD's do I need to keep them at 8ohm in wiring to keep them at there rated freq responses? If I wire them down to say 4ohms at the amp will this change the way they act kinda like a crossover does? My amp makes plenty of power at 8 ohms so that's not a huge concern.

Also does installation under dash need to keep them level off axis facing my shins or tilted up on axis facing my head? After doing some reading I may actually try to get this thing to be loud as piss an still sound desirable to SQ people. I actually like a lot of different music so maybe I won't be so hard headed and try to do this the right way here. At this point I have roughly 8k in this system. No sense pissing away the front stage.

I slept an let the guy sell the linked stuff so if anyone has opinions on higher or middle end HLCD's that would be great. Budget is around 400.00 maybe.

[ssh 924]

You won't need to wire them to 4ohms--high sensitivity ftw.

Not input on aiming.

[Shogen 325]

Ok question,

If I do get nice HLCD's do I need to keep them at 8ohm in wiring to keep them at there rated freq responses? If I wire them down to say 4ohms at the amp will this change the way they act kinda like a crossover does? My amp makes plenty of power at 8 ohms so that's not a huge concern.

Also does installation under dash need to keep them level off axis facing my shins or tilted up on axis facing my head? After doing some reading I may actually try to get this thing to be loud as piss an still sound desirable to SQ people. I actually like a lot of different music so maybe I won't be so hard headed and try to do this the right way here. At this point I have roughly 8k in this system. No sense pissing away the front stage.

I slept an let the guy sell the linked stuff so if anyone has opinions on higher or middle end HLCD's that would be great. Budget is around 400.00 maybe.

I would like to see you get through this too... been loving your work/build log

[jcarter1885 995]

You mean wiring a pair of horns together so the amp is bridged at 4 ohms, that would be pointless. They wont have channel seperation and it wouldnt sound right, you need to keep left and right seperation. If you wire them together then you minus well stick with the supertweeters you currently own. Power is not an issue, they wont need anywhere the power supertweeters need to get loud.

As far as any other HLCD's these are probably the only one's you will find. Not to many people selling theirs and there arent that many brands who make the bodies. So your best bet is to get a new pair from Eric Stevens unless you can find a pair of used bodies, then you can pick a HLCD compression driver from parts-express.com.

As far as setting them up, browse the HLCD section under diyma.com forum. There is plenty of information on mounting, tuning and any other valuable information needed to set them up properly. Even emailing Eric Stevens will get you the best info around, he has the patent to the horns thats why Image Dynamics cant sell them anymore. The same reason why you just cant buy the horn bodies from woofersetc.com aswell.

[OuTLaWeD 110]

maybe this is something you might want to look into. they sound pretty damn good and get loud http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=277-084

[swift 501]

That wasn't the question guys, I'm not worried about trying to throw more power at them. I'm asking if I needed to split channels and they where wired at 4ohms does that change the characteristics of how they play frequency wise. Example, if you have a crossover that is rated at 8 ohms to say 3khz, an it's wired to 4ohms you may have changed the crossover point to say 4.5khz by doing so.

I understand channel separation. Never have I had anything bridged so the entire front plays mono.

Thanks and I will check with Eric Stevens

[ssh 924]

Aren't you using your head-unit for processing, not an on-board/inline crossover?

[jcarter1885 995]

I dont see how you can run an 8 ohm driver as 4 ohms, maybe im missing something.

[ssh 924]

I dont see how you can run an 8 ohm driver as 4 ohms, maybe im missing something.

Good point, he can't.

[swift 501]

I dont see how you can run an 8 ohm driver as 4 ohms, maybe im missing something.

Good point, he can't.

(2) 8ohm speakers run parallel = 4ohm load.

Does that effect the way the speaker plays at all. Will a speaker have the same quality throughout its freq range if wired that way is the question

[jcarter1885 995]

With an in-line crossover yes the frequency changes with ohm load, so yes it will affect the sound quality if the crossover drops lower than what the speaker can play. If you have to correct crossover for a 4 ohm load then it shouldnt affect the sound quality as long as the speakers are wired to 4 ohms.

[ssh 924]

I dont see how you can run an 8 ohm driver as 4 ohms, maybe im missing something.

Good point, he can't.

(2) 8ohm speakers run parallel = 4ohm load.

Does that effect the way the speaker plays at all. Will a speaker have the same quality throughout its freq range if wired that way is the question

Let's back up a second. These drivers you keep referring to as "8ohm speakers." Are these the horns your talking about, or midbass drivers? I was presuming horns since you haven't picked a definite set of horns, and therefore hadn't picked a midbass driver yet.

If horns, then why would you wire two together, as that would create mono--unless you decided to use 2 per side, and 4 total--which makes no sense.

If your taking about using multiple midbass drivers than I retract my previous statement about not being able to do it.

My other point was: if your using your headunit for active processing then it doesn't matter what ohm load anything is, the crossover points will not be effected.

Edited December 11, 2012 by stefanhinote

[swift 501]

I dont see how you can run an 8 ohm driver as 4 ohms, maybe im missing something.

Good point, he can't.

(2) 8ohm speakers run parallel = 4ohm load.

Does that effect the way the speaker plays at all. Will a speaker have the same quality throughout its freq range if wired that way is the question

Let's back up a second. These drivers you keep referring to as "8ohm speakers." Are these the horns your talking about, or midbass drivers? I was presuming horns since you haven't picked a definite set of horns, and therefore hadn't picked a midbass driver yet.

If horns, then why would you wire two together, as that would create mono--unless you decided to use 2 per side, and 4 total--which makes no sense.

If your taking about using multiple midbass drivers than I retract my previous statement about not being able to do it.

My other point was: if your using your headunit for active processing then it doesn't matter what ohm load anything is, the crossover points will not be effected.

You know if you simply answered my question instead of asking more questions or trying to figure out what I'm doing this would all be much simpler.

What if I want to run my front stage off of a 2 channel amp? Then wouldnt it make sense to run a 8ohm tweeter and a 8ohm mid in parallel at a 4ohm load with the appropriate crossovers in place to do so? And if you did that would the tweeter still play at the same quality as it would if it was wired separately at 8ohms?

Its was a real simple question that cant get answered because you are trying to hard too figure out how or what I am doing.

It really is a yes or no question. Does a 8ohm speaker play the same wired to 4 ohms as it does at 8ohms? Forget the crossover point, the power, etc.

Example answer 1.... Yes, it doesnt matter what ohm load its wired to it will still play the exact way it was designed.

Example answer 2..... No, if you wire a 8ohm tweeter or mid to 4ohm it will throw off its fs and could effect performance.

Thats all I was asking. Nothing more, nothing less. Maybe the question was simply too stupid to even answer. lol

Edited December 11, 2012 by swift

[jcarter1885 995]

If you run horns it wouldnt be wise to run the mid and horn together, the horns will outperform any mid seeing the same power.

If your talking about a regular tweeter and midbass driver then it depends where you put your inline crossover. I hope you wouldnt put it after your wired the speakers together becuase then your mid and tweet will playing the same frequency. I currently have my crescendo tweet and rockford mid set up this way but my in-line crossover is right after the tweeter before I connected my two speakers together. Hope that makes sense, it does affect sound quality some because you cant seperate the power so either the mid or tweet can distort before the other. You cant play your mids the way they are designed to play so they will natural roll-off which can cause beaming and so on.