Sub woofer cone area chart

[ssh 924]

I guess for starters I really don't see the point behind any of these charts. Not to devalue stephan's work.....but com'on, it's basic math that anyone capable of successfully operating a computer should be able to figure out on their own in a matter of minutes with a calculator. It would probably take more time to pull up a chart than it would to just figure it out by hand. I mean seriously, would people really not be able to figure out the area of more than one circle, then compare that number to another, on their own without use of a chart? Can someone not look on the companies website for Sd, multiply it by the number of drivers they want to use, and do the same for a different sized driver and then compare the two? If someone can't manage to figure out this little bit of information on their own, then they should probably to revisit elementary school as that is where the basic skill sets required to accomplish this feat are acquired.

Its not on the money but it does show how to get the most bang for your buck. So the numbers would just be a bit smaller if measured properly, but 1-18 should always have more cone area then 2 -12's for example; and this is what it shows. Its a generalized chart for comparisons.

My main issue with the use of that chart, aside from the laziness required to even need to use that chart, is that it is teaching people wrong information. It may be close enough for government work....but it's still wrong. And if it's teaching novices wrong information, then that will simply confuse them more. They'll be missing out on a basic but fundamental concept. Cone area is a simple driver parameter, that is apparently disturbingly misunderstood. It'll only make things worse if we start them off by teaching them wrong information. When you were in school, your educators hopefully didn't teach you that Pi was 3 since that's "close enough" (there have actually been laws passed throughout the years to attempt to change the "officially recognized" value of Pi in various states and localities....ignorance abound).

Second, there can actually be a fairly significant difference in Sd between two same sized drivers. If we assume there's no difference by using incorrect values for determining area, then we are again missing important details. A 12W7 for example has approximately 1db worth of additional cone area than the SSA drivers listed above. That's breaching the realm of audibility, due simply to difference in cone area between two different "twelve inch" drivers that the original chart completely ignores.

Last, most people interested in cone area are trying to determine potential output differences. Cone area alone is useless for this purpose. For that, you would need to know Vd not just Sd. In order to obtain an accurate Vd, you would need an accurate Sd and Xmax. Using inaccurate Sd will misrepresent potential output capabilities and differences. Again, making the information useless and teaching novices wrong information.

Overall, I can't think of a single reason to suggest or recommend the use of wrong information.

I understand your point, cone area isn't the holy grail to more output, especially when the information is incorrect, speakers travel (xmax), motor force and other variables that I don't fully grasp come into play.

Guess I made it since everyone was asking.

Anyhow, whats for dinner?

[Duran 387]

Sometimes I'm weary using manufacturers listed T/S parameters, I do trust Fi and SSA, but there are many companies where I would rather do the measurements myself.

[Shogen 325]

Simple math to some is not the same to others... I wouldn't even attempt to muck up the numbers because I possibly misunderstood a particular measurement or parameter used in the formula. I just thought since it was brought up already and then pointed out as "incorrectly done" that it would be cool/nice and a nice fact to know these numbers of the drivers we so widely support.. It also seemed fairly easy for stef since he had already posted a similar chart... So really it was for shits and giggles that I had asked for this to be done and it could have been left alone/unanswered without any malicious feelings towards any community members.. Again, I was just curious and thought it would be nice if someone who already had a much better understanding than I about these numbers to post them up as a "FUN FACTOID" for the wannabe geeks like myself... lol

Thanks Stef for posting those charts so willingly.. Also thank you Impious for pointing out that it has no "total" bearing on performance or output of the drivers... I hope that people who look at the charts take it for what it is, more information and specifications about the already awesome drivers known to SSA...

[Duran 387]

It is simple math, plugging numbers into a formula is high school math. If someone dropped out of high school they know how to use a calculator anyways.

[///M5 2,833]

Simple math to some is not the same to others... I wouldn't even attempt to muck up the numbers because I possibly misunderstood a particular measurement or parameter used in the formula.

Then even if the charts would be accurate they would be horribly dangerous for you to follow. It seems like every few years there is a movement to grab onto one particular portion of the T/S parameters and use it for purchasing a sub. We've gone through power, excursion, cone area...no matter what you choose it is ALWAYS a terrible idea to use only one parameter to decide anything. If you don't understand the full set of parameters you really shouldn't use any of them for selecting anything.

[Shogen 325]

Then even if the charts would be accurate they would be horribly dangerous for you to follow. It seems like every few years there is a movement to grab onto one particular portion of the T/S parameters and use it for purchasing a sub. We've gone through power, excursion, cone area...no matter what you choose it is ALWAYS a terrible idea to use only one parameter to decide anything. If you don't understand the full set of parameters you really shouldn't use any of them for selecting anything.

Totally agree and my only reference was to creating this chart, not anything else.. But yes many factors come into play with each piece of equipment used and I understand that. I have no intention of using this data to make any decisions on anything btw. Again I only mentioned/requested the chart for mere fun and enjoyment since I was curious and it was previously brought up.

[Inferno333 0]

I saved the chart for my personal use.

Thanks guys!

[///M5 2,833]

I saved the chart for my personal use.

Thanks guys!

Really should re-read my comments, saving the chart isn't a good idea.

[eikenator 0]

One thing square subs are good for! It's easier to find the cone area! If I'm not mistaken...which I very easily could be but length by width should be easier

[Duran 387]

One thing square subs are good for! It's easier to find the cone area! If I'm not mistaken...which I very easily could be but length by width should be easier

No, you still need to look at the Sd given in the T/S parameters.

[eikenator 0]

Dang, well...squares are still useless...

[helotaxi 46]

Ease of "calculating" a parameter that WinISD will figure for you with the basic T/S parameters entered hardly seems a "quality" to me in the first place. The square driver is valid in concept, it does give you more cone area for a given sized baffle. The problem has been with the drivers that have actually used square cones and the issue of dealing with the focused stress points created by the shape.

[ATF 4]

[Aaron Clinton 2,372]

[05Trailblazer 1]

pretty interesting, guess this would only work for the same subwoofers. same brand/size/ t/s parameters

[fatdaddy1999 0]

Very Helpful. Thanks

[porkchop 304]

Could use a hand with a little project i am working on...

I want to compare the vd of two scenarios.

When i begin to compare, i get lost in the certainty of that i have effectively converted each of the t/s parameters into the proper form.

 

If someone could give me a hand, it would be appreciated.

 

I would like to compare the vd of ;

4 18" PSI Platform 3

SD 1230cm^2

xmax 60mm

To

6 15" SSA Zcons

Sd 810cm^2

Xmax 29 

i believe i qouted the t/s correctly