Create more AC AMPS?

[Typicaljawaiian 3]

How would I go about creating more AC AMPS to go into the sub. I feel this would lower my box rise, true or false?

I'm getting high AC Voltage readouts but I feel the AMPS are lacking thus creating a high ohm load.

More DC amps going into the Sundown 3000? That's the only thing I can think of.

This is a rundown of what I have installed

'09 Toyota Yaris

Pioneer avh 3100 2 din DVD (4 volt out)

Pioneer 3 way 5 1/4's & 6x9's

Pioneer 600 x 4 (4 channel amp)

AA SMD 15" Sub

Sundown saz 3000d

DC Power 150/320 amp alt

1 Kinetik HC 1200 (up front)

1 Kinetik Hc 2400 (2.5 ft from the amp)

Big 3 w/ extra grounds all in Fosgate 1/0

1 run pos. (~14 ft) front battery to rear batt (Knu 1/0)

Rear batt grounded to seat belt bolt (Knu 1/0)

1 run each pos. & neg (~2.5 ft) rear batt to amp (Fosgate 1/0)

Three 300 amp fuses - One fuse from (Alt. to hc 1200). Two fuses from (HC 1200 to HC 2400) positive run only!

Stinger SVMB (blue)

With all that what can I do. Eliminate the fuses? How much power loss do they cause? Just do unfused runs of 1/0? I definitely think w/ this electrical I should be seeing more than

32.66 amps x 87.6 volts (50hz burp)???????????

[Typicaljawaiian 3]

Sorry, it's a dual 2 ohm sub wired to .8 ohm

[Typicaljawaiian 3]

Sorry again but that's 2861 watts @ 2.68 ohm. So yeah, what options to get the rise down? Different box design?

Right now I have 4^3 @31.5hz w/ ~28 inches of port (6"x14" flared PSP Port)

I WANNA CRACK 3000 WATTS!!!

[shizzzon 461]

more batteries

[KU40 173]

Sorry, it's a dual 2 ohm sub wired to .8 ohm

You mean 1 ohm. You can't wire a dual 2 ohm sub to 0.8 ohm unless you're talking about the DCR of the sub, in which case saying it's dual 2 ohm isn't right either. You're mixing impedance and resistance.

Sorry again but that's 2861 watts @ 2.68 ohm. So yeah, what options to get the rise down? Different box design?

Right now I have 4^3 @31.5hz w/ ~28 inches of port (6"x14" flared PSP Port)

I WANNA CRACK 3000 WATTS!!!

Different box design. You're going about this the wrong way. The amp responds to what the sub is telling it, not vice versa. Final Impedance of the sub is a function of the driver and the box. The amp has nothing to do with it. If the sub tells your amp I'm 2 ohms at 50 hz, the amp will respond accordingly and send a certain voltage and amps (together equaling power). If you send the sub a 30 hz signal, the sub will tell the amp a different impedance number and the amp will then put out a certain voltage and amp amount. The best thing you can do to maximize power from the amplifier standpoint is supply it with enough power from the electrical system. The more power you put in, the more you can get out.

[onebadmonte 235]

Not to be a smarty pants, but try a bigger amp like the sundown 4500. Maybe an equalizer to boast the frequency you peak at? That second one might not garner much approval around these parts though.

[Randal Johnson 544]

more batteries

This !!!

[topgun 262]

First off. Do not take your fuses out, that is asking for trouble. You will not see any noticeable voltage loss over them, don't even think about pulling them out.

[ssh 924]

Add batteries, get a bigger amp. Going from 2861watts to 3000watts won't be noticeable unless your on a tl.

And the fuses are there for a reason...

[Randal Johnson 544]

First off. Do not take your fuses out, that is asking for trouble. You will not see any noticeable voltage loss over them, don't even think about pulling them out.

Truth !!!

[Typicaljawaiian 3]

When I check impedance on individual coils I get 1.4 - 1.5 and when I wired them parallel I got .75 - .8

A lot of responses were to get more batteries.........would this really help? I see a little difference but not much when I went from stock batt to the two Kinetiks. I was hoping for more power at idle. When I clamped the alternator @ idle the most I saw was ~57 amps DC. Voltage was dipping to ~12.3 on tones. Another thing is the alt took a good while to get to the 57 amps it wasnt very quick at "catching up". However at 2000+ rpm the alternator is a BEAST! Should I contact DC Power about a smaller pulley possibly. Im just not to impressed w/ the 1200/2400 combo. As far as getting more batteries, the best I could do would be swap the 1200 for an 1800.......

I know you guys are like "throw another 2400 on the left hand side but...............that space is for the wife and two kids belongings lol!

Ill try contacting Rob to see if a smaller pulley is possible for my alternator. BTW, excellent and informative responses and I learn new shit everytime I log on to SSA

Edited August 19, 2010 by Typicaljawaiian

[kirill007 52]

The box also has a lot to do with impedance rise...

[Typicaljawaiian 3]

2800+ watts @ 2.6 ohm is not bad though seeing as the amp is rated for 3000 watt @ 1 ohm I should have got the dual 1 ohm SMD

[Julian 641]

The box also has a lot to do with impedance rise...

[kirill007 52]

2800+ watts @ 2.6 ohm is not bad though seeing as the amp is rated for 3000 watt @ 1 ohm I should have got the dual 1 ohm SMD

No, 0.5 ohm isn't very smart.

Not always impedance rise is going to help u out.

[Julian 641]

2800+ watts @ 2.6 ohm is not bad though seeing as the amp is rated for 3000 watt @ 1 ohm I should have got the dual 1 ohm SMD

No, 0.5 ohm isn't very smart.

Not always impedance rise is going to help u out.

Also it seems your electrical isn't stout enough, you should look into a runflat kit and take out your spare and put additional batteries in there. With your electrical .5 ohms would be KILLER on your electrical system and run down the life of your amplifier.

[Typicaljawaiian 3]

Im preeeeeeeeeetty sure I would get a rise up to at least 1 ohm? I could see two dual 1's wired to somewhere ~.25 being fatal to the amplifier. Guess i'll just have to test that out myself

[Impious 1,476]

How would I go about creating more AC AMPS to go into the sub. I feel this would lower my box rise, true or false?

What would cause you to think this?

I'm getting high AC Voltage readouts but I feel the AMPS are lacking thus creating a high ohm load.

It sounds like you need a lesson on the basics.

The impedance isn't "created" by the source as you seem to be implying. You can't just increase the current output and expect impedance to decrease. By just randomly plugging numbers into Ohms Law it may appear this is possible; but it's not. Certain values in the actual circuit must be known before you can attempt to incorporate Ohms Law. The voltage and amperage you are measuring don't create an impedance. You may calculate the impedance, by using Ohms Law, because of the known variables at your disposal (the measured voltage and amperage). But the only reason you are calculating for impedance is because you are measuring the voltage and current, so you need to calculate the missing variable; impedance.

To keep things simple, lets assume we are playing a test tone through the system. The load (the speaker in our case) has an impedance. This is a physical property of the loudspeaker, not a theoretical figure calculated by Ohms Law (even if calculating it is how you are able to determine what value the impedance is). The amplifier is operating at a certain level of voltage output. These two properties are going to determine the power output of the amplifier and as a result the amount of current drawn by the load. If the voltage output is 50V and the load is 4ohm, the power output would be 625w and the current output would be 12.5A. If the voltage output is 50V and the load is 2ohm, the power output would be 1250w and the current output would be 25A.

The impedance of the speaker is a result of multiple different factors. The design of the enclosure, the frequency being played and the amount of heat in the coil are all going to affect impedance rise. The impedance of a 1ohm speaker at resonance may be 20ohm or more, and there's nothing you can do about it. The only way to increase the amperage output in the above example is to decrease the impedance of the speaker or increase the voltage output of the amplifier. You can not increase the amperage to decrease the impedance. It simply doesn't work that way.

I assume your ultimate goal here is to get more power into the subwoofer. If you want to increase the power the subwoofer is receiving, you either need to decrease the impedance of the load (which is NOT going to happen by "creating more AC Amps") or increase the voltage output of the amplifier (which may not be possible without changing amplifiers). Just an FYI, what's going to happen when you push more power into the speaker is that the coil is going to heat up more, causing it's resistance to rise higher, creating a higher impedance, not lower.

Are you aiming for an SPL fart cannon or a daily driver system? If your goal is a daily driver system, forget about impedance rise. Forget about measuring voltage and current. Just forget about it, they are ultimately unimportant to your goal. You won't have enough control over any of it to make any difference, so just stop worrying about it.

[Typicaljawaiian 3]

^^^^ Thanks Bro ^^^^

Just figured ac volts divided by ac amps = rise. Was wondering if there was a way to up the amps somehow causing more watts less rise. Kinda made sense to me when I started this topic.

Class in session, typicaljawaiian raises his hand in attendance!

[PHATBOi 38]

How would I go about creating more AC AMPS to go into the sub. I feel this would lower my box rise, true or false?

What would cause you to think this?

I'm getting high AC Voltage readouts but I feel the AMPS are lacking thus creating a high ohm load.

It sounds like you need a lesson on the basics.

The impedance isn't "created" by the source as you seem to be implying. You can't just increase the current output and expect impedance to decrease. By just randomly plugging numbers into Ohms Law it may appear this is possible; but it's not. Certain values in the actual circuit must be known before you can attempt to incorporate Ohms Law. The voltage and amperage you are measuring don't create an impedance. You may calculate the impedance, by using Ohms Law, because of the known variables at your disposal (the measured voltage and amperage). But the only reason you are calculating for impedance is because you are measuring the voltage and current, so you need to calculate the missing variable; impedance.

To keep things simple, lets assume we are playing a test tone through the system. The load (the speaker in our case) has an impedance. This is a physical property of the loudspeaker, not a theoretical figure calculated by Ohms Law (even if calculating it is how you are able to determine what value the impedance is). The amplifier is operating a a certain level of voltage output. These two properties are going to determine the power output of the amplifier and as a result the amount of current drawn by the load. If the voltage output is 50V and the load is 4ohm, the power output would be 625w and the current output would be 12.5A. If the voltage output is 50V and the load is 2ohm, the power output would be 1250w and the current output would be 25A.

The impedance of the speaker is a result of multiple different factors. The design of the enclosure, the frequency being played and the amount of heat in the coil are all going to affect impedance rise. The impedance of a 1ohm speaker at resonance may be 20ohm or more, and there's nothing you can do about it. The only way to increase the amperage output in the above example is to decrease the impedance of the speaker or increase the voltage output of the amplifier. You can not increase the amperage to decrease the impedance. It simply doesn't work that way.

I assume your ultimate goal here is to get more power into the subwoofer. If you want to increase the power the subwoofer is receiving, you either need to decrease the impedance of the load (which is NOT going to happen by "creating more AC Amps") or increase the voltage output of the amplifier (which may not be possible without changing amplifiers). Just an FYI, what's going to happen when you push more power into the speaker is that the coil is going to heat up more, causing it's resistance to rise higher, creating a higher impedance, not lower.

Are you aiming for an SPL fart cannon or a daily driver system? If your goal is a daily driver system, forget about impedance rise. Forget about measuring voltage and current. Just forget about it, they are ultimately unimportant to your goal. You won't have enough control over any of it to make any difference, so just stop worrying about it.

Thank you. This was a good read. I always learn something from you.

[KU40 173]

When I check impedance on individual coils I get 1.4 - 1.5 and when I wired them parallel I got .75 - .8

No, when you check DCR it's 1.4-1.5 per coil and .8 in parallel.

At idle you need more amps from the alternator. Batteries mainly only help when the voltage from the alternator dips to their resting voltage, which is likely around 12.3, which is why the voltage stops dropping there.

[Typicaljawaiian 3]

Ahhhhhhhh, wish I knew this 5 days ago. Might have invested my money in different areas. Maybe another alt or one that puts out more at idle

Would 14volt batts be an option?

[Typicaljawaiian 3]

14 volt batts as far as helping @ idle voltage? Sorry

[Julian 641]

14 volt batts as far as helping @ idle voltage? Sorry

Yes it should, you'll have more of a reserve to take from instead of your battery being discharged, then your alternator filling it back up. What alternator do you have in your car? Stock? HO? You could add a MLV or a VCM to keep your voltage higher.

[kirill007 52]

Just ask a smalley pulley for you're alt and then you have better idle output.

(It cots less then 1/10th of a battery and will help you out a lot. )

Edited August 20, 2010 by kirill007