~3000W Class A/B or high dampening factor

[agithegreat 0]

Ok guys,

I'm from the UK, but i'm over with you in the states for the next 8 months or so. Staying out in Melbourne, Florida.

I'm after either a decent 3000W rms @1 ohm class a/b amp

Or a class D, or pair of class D's with good dampening factors, with about 3kw @1 ohm ultimatly.

I have back at home an AA Mayhem 15", which i powered with a Powerbass xa3000D. Which i liked, but i want something to control the woofer better. I've heard US amps merlins and i liked the sound of them . They were running @ 2 ohm though, but i could run one per coil.

As i'm not used to prices on things out here, roughly how much money are we talking for a pair of merlins mono's, totalling ~3k?

Or a decent A/B putting out ~3kw?

Second hand, or even brand new...

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Agi

[bigrank916 72]

US amps tend to be a little pricey to me. Look at the SSA store here and you can see what kind of prices they have. They have a few US also.

[Impious 1,476]

but i want something to control the woofer better.

Then build a different box.

But don't purchase a different amplifier with the single prospect of "better woofer control".....damping factor is completely blown out of proportion as far as importance and impact is concerned.

[slim2fattycake 85]

its 60% of the time all the time that the box is the problem.

[agithegreat 0]

Maybe i was a little unclear, i want an amp that will control the sound of the woofer better.

Yes box design is important, but tuned to 24hz, with 4 cubes (after displacements) and only 42" sq of port area isn't exactly unloading the driver....

So any more suggestions of amps?

[SpeakerBoy 64]

Maybe i was a little unclear, i want an amp that will control the sound of the woofer better.

Yes box design is important, but tuned to 24hz, with 4 cubes (after displacements) and only 42" sq of port area isn't exactly unloading the driver....

So any more suggestions of amps?

Thats exactly what they just said may not be the problem. Try a slightly smaller box with a +/- tuning. more port, higher or lower tune (probably a little higher). Hell, you could even try a sealed box. Wood's cheap. Amps are not. I believe the ratio for cuft/port is 12-16sqin/ft. Try polyfill, or a removable port, to give you the opportunity to find whats up. IMO, with a very low tuning like that, the higher notes can start to sound a little sloppy.

Edited October 29, 2009 by DeepSubBoy

[Aaron Clinton 2,372]

Can you describe what it is about the sound that is not to your liking?

[///M5 2,833]

Why do you think this is amplifier related?

[agithegreat 0]

Jesus, welcome to America.

I've been in cars with identical setups, with orion amps. Which sound much better than the PBX did, ok they were different cars...

The sound i'm disliking is sort of air mass moving more-so than sound.

Ok i did 146odd db @ 31hz, which is loud, but it doesn't sound right. I can't rebuild a box as i'm not currently with my box, i was adequately under the impression that my box was sound. I just want how do i say to not kick up a fuss? A different sound???

Can no one suggest me anything, or just criticize further?

[slim2fattycake 85]

We are trying to help you find the problem without costing you money first. We also don't want to suggest you something and then you come back and say that it didn't help because it wasn't the problem in the first place.

Are you saying that you are getting port noise? What is your box's specs?

And I don't understand what you are trying to say right here " I just want how do i say to not kick up a fuss? A different sound???". Can you be a little bit more clear?

[agithegreat 0]

Ok, thanks.

Box specs are above, 3rd post, I think...

I went exactly by what i was recommended by the dealer to do. It's out of 1" MDF with a 2" baffle.

I have done 3 boxes to date for the woofer, with this current one sounding the best.

I'm just after any decent 3kw amp tbh. That i hope will sound better than a PBX xa3000D.

[jcarter1885 995]

I would tune higher, why did you tune to 24hz? What are your goals with the system and how would you like it to sound? First I would do box designs with a higher port tuning frequency and when you get home rebuild the box and see if it helps. But if at the end of the day you still want to find a good amp in the future or for future installs check out the ssa store/ db-r.com/ sundownaudio.com.

[Aaron Clinton 2,372]

Jesus, welcome to America.

I've been in cars with identical setups, with orion amps. Which sound much better than the PBX did, ok they were different cars...

The sound i'm disliking is sort of air mass moving more-so than sound.

Ok i did 146odd db @ 31hz, which is loud, but it doesn't sound right. I can't rebuild a box as i'm not currently with my box, i was adequately under the impression that my box was sound. I just want how do i say to not kick up a fuss? A different sound???

Can no one suggest me anything, or just criticize further?

Who is that first statement directed at? No one is trying to criticize, we are trying to use a smart process of finding out the problem before buying new equipment. And I mirror what 'phi' says again about wondering if this is port noise.

[jcarter1885 995]

Im thinking its port noise, or you dont have a sub sonic filter low enough to control that woofer on that amp. How low does your subsonic filter go on that amp?

[agithegreat 0]

Jesus, welcome to America.

I've been in cars with identical setups, with orion amps. Which sound much better than the PBX did, ok they were different cars...

The sound i'm disliking is sort of air mass moving more-so than sound.

Ok i did 146odd db @ 31hz, which is loud, but it doesn't sound right. I can't rebuild a box as i'm not currently with my box, i was adequately under the impression that my box was sound. I just want how do i say to not kick up a fuss? A different sound???

Can no one suggest me anything, or just criticize further?

Who is that first statement directed at? No one is trying to criticize, we are trying to use a smart process of finding out the problem before buying new equipment. And I mirror what 'phi' says again about wondering if this is port noise.

My first statement was not particuarly aimed at anyone...

It could possibly be port noise, but I have limited space, like low tuning, and the port doesn't suffer from any chuffing noise as i can hear.

I'm tuned so low as i like competing in a format called propper droppers.

Will probably sound bonkers, but here's the forum for you to look over.

http://streetbassers.co.uk/forum/index.php

How about a pair of these... http://www.soundsolutionsaudio.com/store/products/Rockford-Fosgate-T1500%252d1bd.html

One per coil, i would have to get my sub reconed but thats no bother...

Or possibly a pair of these. http://www.soundsolutionsaudio.com/store/products/US-Amps-MD2D.html

Edited October 29, 2009 by Agi

[slim2fattycake 85]

Explain more on the noise you are not liking. You do know setting have to be changed from competition to daily listening right? I compete and theres no way I listen to my system with the same settings. It sounds like complete ass.

Also, is it the box or the sub thats actually making the noise? And why does your sub need to be reconed?

And if you're looking at those amps, I'd look more at the sundowns, better pricing.

[Aaron Clinton 2,372]

Jesus, welcome to America.

I've been in cars with identical setups, with orion amps. Which sound much better than the PBX did, ok they were different cars...

The sound i'm disliking is sort of air mass moving more-so than sound.

Ok i did 146odd db @ 31hz, which is loud, but it doesn't sound right. I can't rebuild a box as i'm not currently with my box, i was adequately under the impression that my box was sound. I just want how do i say to not kick up a fuss? A different sound???

Can no one suggest me anything, or just criticize further?

Who is that first statement directed at? No one is trying to criticize, we are trying to use a smart process of finding out the problem before buying new equipment. And I mirror what 'phi' says again about wondering if this is port noise.

My first statement was not particuarly aimed at anyone...

It could possibly be port noise, but I have limited space, like low tuning, and the port doesn't suffer from any chuffing noise as i can hear.

I'm tuned so low as i like competing in a format called propper droppers.

Will probably sound bonkers, but here's the forum for you to look over.

http://streetbassers.co.uk/forum/index.php

There was a member on here that had a purple Ford and put up crazy numbers in propper droppers a couple of years ago. I would suggest doing some air flow smoothing work on your box if you have not done so yet. Every little bit can help, Jacob of Sundown did a little step by step pictorial on here recently showing the gains he had. Also, Pound That Sound has put up unreal numbers with SQ drivers in the super low ranges, I would take a look at his designs. Many are horns that have curfed ports.

[agithegreat 0]

Yes i have flared the port as much as i can, i will seal off my bot completely when i get back so the box is stuck in place and no air can enter my boot at all, as the baffle sits above parcel shelf height.

The noise doesn't sound like it's coming from the port or the box, or the sub. It's just muffled noise throughout the cabin.

I don't want/need a recone. I'm just considering my options when it comes to other amps. Ideally i want an amp that can put out 3kw at 4 ohms... Thats not going to happen within my budget, however an amp putting out 3kw across a coil a piece for 1 ohm separatly, is.

Second best would of course be to use 1.5kw @ 2 ohms, then run one per coil without the need to recone.

[Aaron Clinton 2,372]

I am not sure if this has been asked, but are you having any enclosure flexing issues? Also, have you done and bracing, deadening or dampening in your vehicle?

[Impious 1,476]

Maybe i was a little unclear, i want an amp that will control the sound of the woofer better.

Yes box design is important, but tuned to 24hz, with 4 cubes (after displacements) and only 42" sq of port area isn't exactly unloading the driver....

So any more suggestions of amps?

I never said anything about unloading. An enclosures effect on a woofer and it's various performance aspects runs much deeper than simply when unloading occurs.

You are looking in the wrong place. Plain and simple. Just because you heard a similar setup in a different car that happened to have different amps and liked that setups sound better is completely unrelated to the amps. There are a couple dozen variables that could be at play that would cause the differences you noted, all of which have nothing to do with the amplifiers damping factor. A new amplifier is not the fix.

It would be helpful if you could go into a little more detail about what it is you are having issues with. Is it like an overhang problem...notes not sounding tight and controlled? I really couldn't get a good handle on what exactly the problem is from your previous description.

[agithegreat 0]

Enclosure doesn't flex, it's braces with 4x2 from top to bottom. The port may well flex a little.

The car is deadened all over 4mm twice all over the boot of some top stuff from darren of UK DB drag.

The doors have a single layer, as does the whole roof.

The car is a renault clio, so clearly the panels still flex .

It's an uncontrolled sound, yes. It's not smooth, thats the only real way to describe it, like other systems i have heard you can hear the sound then at the same time feel the airflow. Well i get the moving airflow alright, but the sound sounds delayed and not as though it's moving the air as it should.

[Notorious97200 339]

The clio is such a small car for al that bass.

We have lots of clio down here, some with tons of bass, but the sound is always better when you're outside the car.

You hear it outside, you feel it inside!!! more (or too much) air pressure inside.