Max Amps In My Civic

[Elix1r 0]

So I am planning on putting a 1000w amp for a sub and possibly a 600w for my component speakers in my 01 civic. Can the battery handle this and if not what should I do?

Thanks everybody

[todd.brust 29]

600 watt amp for comps?!

Are you talking about 600 watts and 1000 watts peak or continuous power?

I can't give you a definite answer, but i can tell you that changing your battery to a high quality deep cycle would put less strain on your electrical system. The big 3 would be a good starting point. I would suggest doing that whether you need a battery or not.

[Elix1r 0]

Continous/rms, and the 600w is 400w at 4ohm, so 100x4rms for some alpine r series 6 1/2s and 6x9s. IF you have any suggestions, please let me know I'm just going by the speakers rms. What is the big three? I just started looking into a stereo system; I'm a newbie.

Thanks

[todd.brust 29]

I think you may be able to get away with a stock battery, but I would suggest doing the big 3. The big 3 is upgrading your ground wires (engine block to ground and negative battery terminal to the chassis) and the alternator to battery wire.

This was discussed over on CSO the other day so i have a good link for you.

http://www.the12volt.com/installbay/...TID=73496&PN=1

There is some good information on actually doing the big 3 there.

You don't have to worry about being a n00b. Everyone has been there and you can only learn by asking questions.

Good Luck with the install!

[Guest zedman]

i can tell you that changing your battery to a high quality deep cycle would put less strain on your electrical system.

Can you please explain this to me. thanks Z

[todd.brust 29]

The deep cycle discharges slower than a conventional battery, however I should have stated that if the alternator is weak, the upgraded battery won't help a whole lot.

[Guest zedman]

Do you have some sort of data to look at to prove this and how would a slow discharge be easier on the electrical system?

Edited March 6, 2008 by zedman

[todd.brust 29]

No i do not, do you have data to disprove me?

I could simply be misinformed. I am not trying to mislead the OP, just trying to help and put in my two cents.

[Guest zedman]

I was just asking if you had data to support your confident suggestion to the OP. How can I refute anything you say if there is not data presented? I was wanting to know why it would be suggested to buy "a high quality deep cycle battery" when there is no empirical evidence that shows what you are suggesting would be helpful. he has a very small battery in his car and there may be other options that could be more beneficial than a high dollar battery. Which leads me back to the previous question.... Can you back up what you are saying with data. no attacks just wanting to know where the suggestion is coming from. Z

[todd.brust 29]

I have no data to prove anything as stated before. There are many suggestions made on this forum based on personal experience. That is all that I am basing my suggestion off of, personal experience. Since i have gotten a different battery, I have had higher voltage readings more consistently while running my amp. The OP asked what he could do to help his electrical system if needed, and i suggested a battery instead of a HO Alternator seeing that a battery usually installs much easier than an alternator and usually costs less.

[sqguy 0]

Come on guys, a better/fresher/bigger/second battery holds more power. So when the amp draws the weak alternator down to the 12v of the battery....a weak battery will drop lower maybe 10v if you overrun it that bad (and make your headlights dim badly). Remember that the battery still has to run the rest of the car. Strong battery setup will stay at 12 or closer to 12. Big alternator will run it at ~14 so that is why everyone says go alternator because you get more music wattage at 14 than 12v. You test at your amp to find out what you got. If your wiring is not large enough you will have lower voltage at amp than at battery, larger difference the smaller/longer your wire is (at max draw). That is why you run large wire to trunk; small wire will lower voltage x amount per foot...meaning short run is ok if it large enough to not get hot but long run needs to be larger yet to keep voltage up when you add up all the distance.

Note that if you have a monster alternator that can supply the amps at 14v all the time, you don't have as big a need for multiple batteries for when it overdraws the alternator down to the 12v battery because it wont.

OMHO I don't worry about changing the stock wire to a stock alternator because you did not change the output of that alternator...and factory should have right size wire on it. This may not always be true and it may help a little bit, but often I don't see a difference. I would not recommend taking out any stock wiring I try to add to it if possible, and that is just more 'free' wire but that is me. I would check the alt wire and any connections if you leave it, make sure they are in good condition. You can test voltage at alt and battery to find out loss under max load.

So it really depends on if you want 14v or 12v, how much you want to spend, etc. You must have the big wire to your amps to get what power you have, and a good battery is good because you still need a buffer for any alternator or it is harder on the alternator. They can't react really fast but the battery power is always there to cover for it. Of course if you run it with the car off the battery(s) are your only source and more is better. More capacity and more of them. I don't like a real deep charge battery because they are not made for a large fast draw. It depends on your draw and number of batteries if you want to use them, or use a starter deep charge that can do more draw at once. Unless you play if for a long time on battery alone I would not worry about them, if you did that a deep charge can hold more total power. That should all be right, hope that helps you understand how it works better so you can set it up best for your use. You can find calculators for wire loss and stuff on the net.

[Adrian_D 520]

One thing that would tempt me to pick up a deep cycle would be the larger number of discharge-charge cycles compared to a regular battery.

[fbi90909 0]

get a second deep cycle battery for the rear. run a big 3 in 1/0 guage. you should be fine from there with that kind of power. i used to run about 2.2k on stock battery, stock alt. nothing else.

now i run a second battery + big 3, though still stock alt on about 1.7k. it is a much better improvment to help stablize voltage but really what would help you more would to get a bigger alt. hondas have chit for alts and is the biggest down side when putting a high powered system in these cars.

Edited March 6, 2008 by fbi90909

[Guest zedman]

Strong battery setup will stay at 12 or closer to 12. Big alternator will run it at ~14 so that is why everyone says go alternator because you get more music wattage at 14 than 12v. You test at your amp to find out what you got.

I do not agree with this.

Do you have data to back up the rest of your opinion?

[johnecon2001 82]

Sure it's better to get an alternator rather than a battery first. However, most people don't have $3-400 to plunk down on an alternator and would rather spend $<200 on a battery. While not the optimal situation, it'll still be better than stock.

Everyone take a chill pill with all this "data" bullshit.

[todd.brust 29]

Strong battery setup will stay at 12 or closer to 12. Big alternator will run it at ~14 so that is why everyone says go alternator because you get more music wattage at 14 than 12v. You test at your amp to find out what you got.

I do not agree with this.

Do you have data to back up the rest of your opinion?

The more music with higher voltage is all dependent on the amplifiers power supply. Whether it is regulated or unregulated. With a Regulated power supply, the voltage rails will remain the same at 12 or 14 volts, however with a unregulated power supply the voltage rails will vary with the input voltage to the amplifier. More Voltage with the same load will result in higher power. There needs to be any data to prove this, it is a simple fact as to how a power supply works.

Sorry John, just wanted to answer this question.

But to the OP, I think you can get away with just the big 3, but it doesn't hurt to add a battery. And that's all i have to say here now. lol

[Guest zedman]

So now my request for data instead of an uneducated guess is bullchit? Wow I come here to learn about my hobby. I do not take what anyone says for more than an opinion. I was asking for raw data or sifted through information so I can make my own intelligent decision. It seems as though I must stop my quest for the truth because the"super moderator" said so. lol what ever. Z

[sqguy 0]

Strong battery setup will stay at 12 or closer to 12. Big alternator will run it at ~14 so that is why everyone says go alternator because you get more music wattage at 14 than 12v. You test at your amp to find out what you got.

I do not agree with this.

Do you have data to back up the rest of your opinion?

What part don't you agree with?

[johnecon2001 82]

So now my request for data instead of an uneducated guess is bullchit? Wow I come here to learn about my hobby. I do not take what anyone says for more than an opinion. I was asking for raw data or sifted through information so I can make my own intelligent decision. It seems as though I must stop my quest for the truth because the"super moderator" said so. lol what ever. Z

You don't need to stop your quest for the truth, you just need to stop being a dick about it.

[sqguy 0]

Here are the ratings for an Alpine MRV-1002. This amp has a regulated power supply, I have tested the rail voltage and it does vary the driver duty cycle in the PS accordingly to keep it stable. Note the 50% change in ratings. In real life that is not 50% louder of course, but still a significant difference. Why else do you think all amps are rated at 14.4v now, and most cars can't even do that. Yes it is marketing, most people will never see 14.4v ratings get to their speakers.

Power Output at 12V (20Hz ~ 20kHz):

2 x 100W @ 4 ohm (0.08% THD)

2 x 200W @ 2 ohm (0.3% THD)

1 x 400W @ 4 ohm bridged (0.3% THD)

Power Output at 14.4V (20Hz ~ 20kHz):

2 x 150W @ 4 ohm (0.08% THD)

2 x 300W @ 2 ohm (0.3% THD)

1 x 600W @ 4 ohm bridged (0.3% THD)

http://ampguts.realmofexcursion.com/Alpine_MRV-1002/

[todd.brust 29]

^^^^^DATA!! whoooooooooooooooooooooooooo ^^^^

[sqguy 0]

Lol, I guess there might be someone out there that has never read ratings for amps....and does not know how a transformer works, or that amps have one, etc. Some amps will run about the same output 12 to 14, but is not common....they all want more output and by doing that you would limit 14v output to the same level as 12v more or less.