Impious

That is why there is a gain knob. Turn it ALL the way down first and you'll be surprised how little power they get. Actually start with both all the way down, set the mids and then raise the horns to MATCH. Never use voltage to gain set. Doubt he'll have to raise the gain any on the horns I had a 50wpc @ 8ohm amp on my horns with the gain set all the way down and a -12 level setting on the processor...LOL

It makes sense to not care how a speaker sounds in actuality rather than how the paper says it sounds. You sir, are an idiot. Let's not clutter this thread with your complete lack of understanding of acoustics and most things in general, which you have thoroughly demonstrated thus far in our encounters. Keep the posts in this thread on topic or they will be removed. If you wish to discuss objective driver evaluations (and your apparently lacking ability to understand them) versus subjective listening impressions (differences which you clearly don't understand), start another thread and we can gladly discuss it.

BS Eric... You were told exactly what was going on time after time, and when I finally gave you an exact date it would be done, guess what? It was done.. You just pitched a fit the day before, demanded a refund and I GAVE someone else the alt I built for you. Shitty thing is man I bent over BACKWARDS to get that done for you too because of how things went down and how bad you needed it. Too bad for you though man, the XP's for the Hyundai's turned out pretty freaking SICK. You could have had your alt and would have absolutely loved it too... Get over it and move on bro... I don't care how good your alts may be, or how bad your suppliers have stiffed you with delays. You act like a complete douche to customers on the internet forums. This is not the first time I've seen you spout off with smart-ass comments towards a customer on here. It actually seems to be a pretty common reaction from you when a customer says something you don't like. I'm not arguing that you don't have a right to respectfully defend your company. But for fuck's sake, handle it with a little dignity. There's a right way and a wrong way to handle a situation, it seems more often than not you chose the latter. There's always two sides to a story.....but given the way you conduct yourself on here, I'm not surprised by all of the negative things said about the CS from your company given you can't even remotely conduct yourself in a professional manor when interacting with customers here on the forum. Proving a customer wrong isn't winning. DC isn't the first company in history to have supplier issues and unhappy customers.....however a shit load of those other companies are capable of handling the situation with far more dignity, professionalism and respect.

Pretty much covers it all. The only thing I would add is that skin effect is also relative to frequency in AC. Within the audible bandwidth, it can basically be ignored for our purposes. You need to get closer to RF frequencies before it really becomes an issue.

Well what do you have to hide? lol I don't like people knowing when I'm reading a thread, which threads I've read and when I'm on/off line.

I always sign in anonymously.

Image Dynamics and USD Audio are the two main sources of car audio specific horns. Not sure of your budget, if you can buy new you could go that route. But they are much more affordable on the used market. In Image Dynamics lineup you should look for the CD1-Pro, CD2-Comp or if the budget allows the newer Ultra horns. On the used market the CD2's can be found for around $250-$300. USD Audio I'm not as familiar with, and really their horns a little more scarce. As for processing, if you don't want an external trunk mounted processor you can look for a headunit that has a built in 3-way crossover (highpass for the horns, bandpass for the mids and lowpass for the sub). You want to make sure the highpass can be set as low as ~1khz, steeper the slope the better. Ideally 24db/oct. A decent 13-band graphic or 7-band parametric should be sufficient for tuning the horns to an acceptable level for your listening purposes.

Yes, that specific vehicle had a lot of work done. It was also the first of it's kind, so the available options weren't as ready-made as they are today. But you entirely missed the point of that particular example. As long as you have room for the horns mounting them is not a difficult task, especially for a professional installer. Building for the 10" mids wouldn't be any more difficult than the work required to fit multiple drivers, as you suggested and as he was originally going to have done. And moderate tuning is all that's really needed to bring a horn into the realm of "sound quality" that would be satisfactory for this particular installation. I don't see how this route would be any more challenging than either the path he was originally intent on going or the route you've suggested, and the results would be better in just about every sense. Where is the downside?

Honestly I couldn't care less about the subjective reviews that will be posted. Far more interested in the T/S parameters and other objective measurements you have, such as an FR graph How long is the presale going to be open for?

There is this huge misconception that the only way to achieve "loud" is to completely ignore basic acoustic principles. To the contrary, following sound acoustic principles is the most effective means of achieving your goals. To put it into perspective.....the winningest (and most infamous) vehicle in SQ competition history consisted of a speaker system that would put almost all of these SPL vehicles to shame in terms of output capabilities (for the front stage, obviously the sub stage would be louder in the SPL vehicles). HLCD under the dash and a high efficiency 10" mid per door (or kickpanel). Done. You would have to worry more about hearing damage from the front stage than the substage, as the front stage would literally be capable of deafening you if you allowed it to play at it's full potential. You need to button down your plans for your speakers before you select a headunit for processing. If you want to do the eight 8's and four tweeters thing you can, it's your system. I just think it's the wrong path. As for a Stetsom dealer.....check the SSA Store, they carry Stetsom products.

You catch on quick To answer your original question......I don't see the AC Three.2 as being a valuable option unless you absolutely need 2 auxillary inputs. Not many of it's features are very helpful in any grand sense and really most mid-level aftermarket headunits can easily match and/or exceed it's processing capabilities. So I would mark it off of the list. I can't help you select a processor that does fit your needs, because it doesn't sound like you know what your needs actually are. As for the speakers......yes, it's a bad idea. Completely unnecessary for anything other than a show car built to wow the ignorant masses. For starters, anytime you have more than one speaker playing the same frequency you have the potential for constructive and destructive interference. This in turn can create anomalies in the frequency response that will ruin the sound and can't be fixed with an equalizer. There are some caveats where multiple speakers can work well......but with three 8" mids per channel playing fairly high in a 2-way setup, I realistically don't see the results being anything more than craptastic. It might be loud, but if actually enjoying the sound is also one of your goals I don't think this is the route to take. I'm scared to ask this question......but if a professional is installing the system for you, why isn't the professional also assisting you in system design and layout? I say I'm scared to ask because most professional installers seem to be good at fabrication and can rattle off Metra part numbers from memory but they don't actually understand much on the acoustic end of things. So I'm not sure if their assistance would be an asset or a liability. What speakers did you intend on using?

Impossible to answer without knowing what exactly your wants and needs are as far as processing is concerned. For starters...... How is your setup going to be executed? Where are the mids and tweeters going to be located? Why do you have eight 8" mids? What frequency range are the 8's and tweeters going to be playing? Are you using active or passive crossovers? Does the processor need to have active crossovers? What are your goals for the system? Accurate soundstage reproduction, flat frequency response, or just loud without sounding too bad? What type of EQ processing power do you want/need? What is your budget? Why do you have eight 8" mids? Answering those questions is only a start to heading in the direction of being able to assist you with meaningful responses.

T/S parameters? Just searched the other thread and didn't see it posted anywhere.

Do you like fishsticks? Stick them in and around your mouth? He likes to dip them in some creamy white horseradish sauce first........

The two ports aren't tuned equally. The ports are the same dimensions, which creates two different tuning frequencies since one chamber is half the volume of the other. The point is to have two separate tuning frequencies.

Is it possible for different amplifier classes or different components to cause a difference in sound? Sure, it's possible......IF the power, gain, frequency response, noise or distortion are audibly affected. Realistically speaking, amplifier classes are evolved to the point that prior deficiencies have been solved so there's not going to be an audible difference in the FR, noise or distortion in an amplifier of decent design. So in the end, it's going to come down to power and system settings. Different components......all you really need in amplifier (aside from reliability and longevity) is a flat FR and inaudible noise and distortion. If those qualifications are met with two different sets of various components, and power output is unchanged, what is going to make the amplifiers sound different? Certainly you could change components and have an FR that's no longer flat, audible but pleasing distortion, etc. But it has to impact one of those factors to be audible. Some people claim that X capacitors "widen the stage" and create a "warm, smooth midrange". Really? What changed to cause this? If it wasn't power, gain, frequency response, noise or distortion.....then nothing.

What's really going to bake your noodle is the fact that some amplifiers on the market use the exact same board with slightly different components used....but one can cost 2x or more the price of the other. Arc Audio being one of those brands. They're Zeff designed boards, companies such as Clarion and Cerwin Vega have offered essentially identical amplifiers at half the price. So why do people still buy the Arcs?

Also keep in mind Arc rates the SE series @ .03% distortion, whereas most other amplifiers are rated @ 1% distortion. So, assuming their ratings are accurate, you are going to get more than 600w of power out of the SE if measured at the same 1% THD measurement that the majority of other amplifiers are rated at. How much more, I don't know. But it'll be more than 600w @ 1% THD.

"A watt is a watt" is the wrong way to word what you are trying to express. What you are trying to ask is if there is anything intrinsic to an amplifier or amplifier design that would inherently make two otherwise identical amplifiers "sound" different. The important performance characteristics of an amplifier can basically be broken down to: Power, gain, frequency response, noise, and distortion. There are no other mystical properties to an amplifier itself (other than built in processing features such as crossovers, etc) that will affect the sound. If two amplifiers "sound" different, one of those 5 characteristics must necessarily have been affected in an audible manor. If one of those 5 characteristics are not affected or significantly different enough to cause an audible change in sound, then no....there won't be an audible difference in sound from the amplifier. This is includes amplifier "class" (the old A/B vs D debate, etc). You are not going to hear a difference in amplifier class that is not capable of being represented by one of those categories. Some people claim all sorts of crazy things about the intrinsic "sound quality" properties of an amplifier or certain components within an amplifier. All you have to ask yourself is.....Do one of these mystical properties or components directly affect the power, gain, frequency response, noise or distortion in such a way that would cause an audible change in sound? If the answer is no, then what they are proposing is not going to audibly affect the sound of the amplifier regardless of what else they claim. Certainly there are reasons for purchasing a more expensive amplifier. Reliability, features, aesthetics, prestige, customer support, warranty, etc etc. EDIT: And I'll add that amplifiers are fairly well understood beasts. Getting a flat frequency response and inaudible distortion is a fairly trivial task. So really, unless the amplifier was either intentionally designed with a non-flat FR or they simply cheaped out on design, most differences in amplifier "sound" are going to come down to a difference in power output or system settings. There's no reason to purchase an amplifier based on "sound characteristics". Purchase based on power output, build quality, features and your budget and customer service/warranty requirements.

Not a 6th order with the driver radiating directly into the listening space. A 6th order bandpass would have two independent and tuned chambers. That enclosure looks like a single enclosure volume with two separate tuning frequencies. You caught me before my ninja edit, I didn't see the larger chamber opposite the woofer. You caught me before my ninja edit I see it now. I was looking at the picture wrong, also missing the right chamber and connecting port. I would agree, looks like it's supposed to be an ABC box.

Not a 6th order with the driver radiating directly into the listening space. A 6th order bandpass would have two independent and tuned chambers. That enclosure looks like a single enclosure volume with two separate tuning frequencies. Oh, damn you ninja edited that shit Duran. Not an ABC either as there would be two separate chambers with a port connecting the two chambers.

Your question(s) are pretty open ended. I guess I wouldn't even really know where to start as I don't know which part you didn't particularly understand, and I thought that article did a pretty good job of explaining it in relatively simple terms. Could you narrow down your confusion some? Distortion, as explained above, is any deviation from the original signal (other than the intended increase in amplitude). The largest distortion generator in a system is the speakers. Though I can take a stab at the daily system part......it seems most people can't hear distortion, or atleast find excessive amounts of it acceptable Seriously though, how offensive distortion is depends on a huge amount of factors. Frequency, level of the various harmonics, masking effects of the music, duration of the signal, etc etc. Basically, distortion is "easy" to hear if you listen to pure tones but much more difficult to notice depending on the various other factors involved. Generally even order harmonics are less offensive than odd order harmonics, and the higher the order of the harmonics the more offensive they are. The "-40db down from the fundamental" is an expression of the level of the particular distortion component compared to the level of the fundamental. If a 50hz tone is played, it will generate harmonic distortion at 100hz (2nd harmonic), 150hz (third harmonic), 200hz (forth harmonic), so on and so forth. So if the 2nd harmonic (100hz) is -40db down from the fundamental, then it is 40db lower in volume than the fundamental.....or, the 2nd fundamental is at an approximately 1% distortion level.

Not sure of the actual area you have to work with, but you will want to port the Dcon. Its above, 31.25 wide, 15 tall, and up to 16 deep, but would prefer around 14. If I did 31.25x15x14.25 with double baffle (what I had figured above), thats 2.789cu before sub/bracing and port. Not sure how to figure port length when doing an L port. Going by the 12volt.com calculator, for 30Hz and 2.5 port width, Id need 31in long port if you use 2.789cu, or 35in if you take in to account for the sub and bracing first (2.509). To figure out the length of a "L" port, you need to "measure" down the middle of the port. Also keep in mind that the entire port doesn't need to be physically inside of the enclosure.

Not sure of the actual area you have to work with, but you will want to port the Dcon.