SilkySmoove

Gorilla Glue is some GOOD stuff!!!! You all might want to check it out. When using it you damp the area you are going to apply the glue to, and as the glue dries it expands to fill in any gaps often times seeping out of the seems depending how much you apply. But nothing sanding can't take care of. Gorilla Glue You can pick it up in your local hardware store; Lowes, Home Depot, etc.

Hello all, Here in the Raleigh, NC area I have been around to a few car audio shops to pick up little things from time to time and I notice that most do not carry any Sundown Audio equipment. To me this has been somewhat of a surprise considering the fact that the company is "local", in the sense that it is based out of the same state and is only a few hours away. The response I have gotten from guys that run these shops is almost offensive to me as a Sundown Audio user. When I ask why they don't carry any Sundown they seem to get on this defensive "high horse" stating that either "Sundown equipment is too expensive, and nobody will buy it" or that "they are just a small company that is here today and will probably be gone tomorrow......I don't want to sale my customers stuff that may not be around tomorrow." What kind of crap is this?!?!?!..........honestly it kind of pissed me off today when I went into this shop to pick up some RCA's and the guy was just talking down on Sundown. The only logical reason I can come up with for these guys talking like this is the fact that they have NEVER experienced/used any Sundown Audio equipment personally. Jacob you and your boys might need to come to Raleigh and show some of these guys whats up!!!! Sincerely, A Satisfied Sundown Audio Customer

What is the name of the shop? I'd rather not say because it is not my intent to get into name calling or hurt someones business. I will just say that it is in Raleigh area.

Hello All, I am just curious to know what can cause a woofers suspension to weaken? As stated in the thread title this is in reference to a Havoc 12" that I have had for a little over a year. I have never overpowered the sub and have always set the gains properly with an O-scope, and after doing so I have always turned the sub output on my deck way down into the negatives to get it to blend properly with my components. The amps I have used on the sub are the Sundown SAE-1000D, SAE-1200D, and most recently the SAZ-1500D. The box I have been using is two cubic feet tuned to 32Hz. This is a box I had built by Fisher customs here on the forums. I am currently in the process of changing up my system and in doing so I removed the sub and noticed that I can easily push down on the cone. And when pushing around the edge of the cone near the surround I hear a little scraping noise, almost as if the coil is scraping against the motor as it moves up and down. The sub still plays fine, everything on the sub looks fine, and nothing smells odd. However, these issues are of concern to me just in case I ever decide to sale the sub. I don't want someone thinking I sold them an abused piece of equipment. Thanks in advance for any input. P.S. I am the original owner of the sub.

All, Thanks for the useful feedback! It looks like I will be doing some research on speaker construction to get a better understanding of their operation.

Impious and thecartel, I completely agree and understand the business standpoint of having to weigh multiple factors when deciding what products to carry/sale. However, my issue with these shop owners is them getting up on their soapbox, so to speak, and talking down as if someone went out of their way to offend them. My genuine inquiry as to why they don't carry Sundown could have simply been answered by "the demand in the area at the moment does not justify us carrying it." Not a rant going in on the company...............I know, nothing to be offended by on my end, but it just caught me off guard a little.

I fully understand what you are saying, and I'm not denying the perceived stability of the "larger/more established companies". As for asking about carrying brand xxx, I did not do it in a hostile or out of line manner. It was just part of our conversation, and I simply asked "why don't you carry Sundown since they are more or less a local company?"..........then the guy flipped lol. He got up on his soap box for a good minute with his long winded explanation.

I guess that's still not good enough for these guys lol

Oh, I'm not denying that point of their service. They are most definitely good for that.

No, there is not a noticeable sag. However, what causes them to loosen up over time? I just always thought that the cone was supposed to be "stiff"

when you check for coil rub, you should push straight down, preferably on the center of the cone. pushing on the outer edge, or unevenly on the cone can cause the coil to rub on a perfectly good sub. the only thing locating the coil in the motor is the spiders and the surround, neither of which is a solid mount. the coil "floats" and goes where it is pushed. I checked out the coil rub again and I agree with your logic..............it only occurs when pushing around the edges, and does NOT happen when pushing in the center of the cone. So just to verify, its nothing to be particularly worried about?

Thanks for the reply Jacob. It just kind of caught me off guard how these guys got sooooo defensive when I asked them why they didn't carry Sundown. Almost as if they felt I was taking a swipe at them for not doing so. I just think that Raleigh is ripe for the picking, especially with all of the college kids around here if one of these shops would carry Sundown products. Their response to buying the same stuff they carry online for the low low is that "you can't be certain that it is the genuine product, plus you don't get the warranty you would get if you bought through us.........." That's the crap that they feed to people who don't know much about car audio and get conned into paying the high prices they charge. I'm just glad I know better lol

I'm the same way as far as buying the vast majority of my stuff online or directly from the manufacturer. But at the same time, like you said, I would like to support the local shops if only they did not charge crazy prices for stuff. For example, the shop I went to today, where the guy was ragging on Sundown, I asked about pricing on getting a box built just out of pure curiosity and he told me that pricing starts at $150 and can exceed $500. In my mind I was thinking that's pretty expensive for something I can buy the materials and do myself for $30. But at the same time I realize that it is a business and they need to make a profit. Here comes the kicker though...........I ask the guy if he had a sample box I could take a look at and he flared up saying "I don't let anybody see the inside of my boxes without purchasing one from me because I do special stuff to them like........" Then I said to him "don't you think that mentality possibly hurts your business?" His response: "You just have to have confidence in me........." Now who in their RIGHT MIND is going to plop down a few hundred bucks on something without having an opportunity to see the quality of the work they are paying for?!?!?! What a jerk. Just know that I will NEVER be going back to that place again. I know that example was off topic lol, so back to the subject at hand. I still feel like these local guys should show some love to a quality company that is pretty much in their back yard.

I would look into active crossovers. They can be had for around 100 bucks and can give you everything you need, plus the ability to run active. Any active crossovers in particular that you would recommend?

Hello all, My question is as follows: When utilizing the RCA output on an amp, such as the 125.2 or 50.4, how is the outputted signal affected by the crossover and gain settings of the amp it is coming from? For example, if I were to use a 50.4 to run tweeters and mid range, and then I wanted to utilize the RCA out of the 50.4 to connect a 125.2 which I would use to run mid-bass. Will the RCA out of the 50.4 only pass the higher frequency signals that it is set for to run the speakers connected to it, or will it simply pass the signal through that it is receiving from the head unit? Thanks for all of the input in advance!!!!

Thanks for the replies! Now my followup question: Is the signal strength/quality degraded by passing through one amp to another? My head unit is not the best considering it is a navigation unit (Kenwood DNX-5120). It has front and rear pre-outs that only produce a little over 2V with the volume practically maxed out. Now I am looking at running a 50.4, 125.2, and 1500D so I've just been going over various connection possibilities in my head. I practically need to turn two sets of pre-outs into four!!!! I know I can use y-splitters, which I am currently using to run the 50.4 on the front set of pre-outs. I'm just not sure how splitting the signal again to run the 125.2 will affect things. I am currently using the rear pre-out for my 1500D. I've been toying with the thought of picking up an Audiocontrol Matrix which would allow me to effectively turn my single front pre-out into the three I need for the 50.4 and 125.2 and ensure that the signal strength is maintained. What are your thoughts????

I would adjust some of your settings, having everything up half way is really leaving your lacking some frequencies. Since you want to play the Mach 5 Audio speakers down low they should be in the front doors instead of rear doors if I read that correctly (really not getting a good midbass experience with them in the back doors especially with the subs in the trunk). I would run the MLI-65's from 60/80hz (Sub Sonic Filter set here) depending how low you have your sub crossed at, the Low Pass Filter @ between the halfway point and 3/4 point of the 50-500Hz range. Then I would try the components on high pass filter from 500Hz on up so you wont be overlapping frequencies, then play with the frequencies from there some more to personal preference but I would start in that area if you want to keep your current speaker setup. Just my .02 Thanks for the input! I will probably take a break from this senior design project and try out your suggestions later on today.

I hate to bring up a topic that I know has been discussed before, but I have some details about my particular scenario that may help you all help me on deciding what to do. The equipment I have that is in question is as follows: -Kenwood DNX-5120 Nav Unit -Sundown 50.4 -Image Dynamics CTX65CS Components (4 ohm) -Mach 5 MLI 6.5" (4 ohm) First off, I have a handheld oscilloscope which I have used to set my gains using a 1kHz 0dB test tone as follows: -EQ flattened and loudness off on head unit -Kenwood DNX-5120 volume can be set to 35/35 without any noticeable clipping, however I set my listening limit to 34/35; at this volume roughly 2.3 VAC is coming from the RCA's, however moving the volume down a tick or two and it quickly dives below 2 VAC -With volume set to 34/35 and 1kHz 0dB test tone playing I adjust the gains on the amp until I see clipping then back it off a little; ended up being around 18 VAC for each of the four channels Now my problem is with my gains set as they should be with NO clipping according to my oscilloscope I am getting some engine whine through my speakers. And as I have experienced in the past, the quickest way to get rid of this whine is to turn down the gain until it is no longer audible. However, you loose volume output. Also, I know that Nav units do NOT have the best sound quality or EQ features due to a lot of their power being used to provide numerous other features, such as navigation. With all of this being said do you think my setup is a candidate for a line driver installation? And for those of you wondering what handheld oscilloscope I have, it is a TPI ScopePlus 440 TPI 440 1Mhz. Handheld Oscilloscope True RMS DMM,tpi440,tpi-440,tpi 440 Thanks!!!!

I finally had a chance to go out and check the crossover settings on my Sundown 50.4. I have the ID comp set high passed, with the dial exactly half-way in between (dial perfectly vertical) 50Hz and 500Hz. I have the MLI's low passed, with the dial exactly half-way in between (dial perfectly vertical) 500Hz and 5kHz. Sub-sonic filter is set exactly half-way in between 10Hz and 500Hz for each set. I was thoroughly surprised to find everything set exactly half-way in between, because I set the filters by ear and never really looked closely at where the dials were set when I was done. Ideally I would assume the tuning dials to adjust the frequency cutoffs linearly, however just by the nature of things I'm sure that is not the case. So your guess is as good as mines in determining a ballpark number for each of the settings described above.

I guess I'm not too astute on appropriate driver selection yet. Sounds like I have some research to do. What exactly are you referring to by me doubling up on frequencies, and what are some/type of drivers you would suggest? Keep in mind that I am looking to keep everything in the stock mounting locations for the time being.

Sorry I have not had the chance to provide the crossover point information because I have been on the road traveling, and I do not remember exactly what I have them set to on the amp. However, on my deck I have the sub at 80Hz (LPF) and both the Mach5 MLI's and ID component set at 80 (HPF). I will take a look at my amp crossover points tomorrow when I get a chance. Currently the interior speakers are mounted in the stock locations. I have the tweeters from the comp set in the location of the stock dash speakers, the 6.5" from the comp set in the front doors, and the Mach5 MLI's in the rear doors. I know these are NOT ideal mounting locations, but my car is fairly new ('08 Altima 3.5SE) and I am trying to hold off on ripping it apart for a little while longer. Budget wise I am willing to spend a few hundred dollars, but at the same time I am not trying to break the bank. Thanks for the continued help guys!

I already have my HU grounded to the chassis of the vehicle. I learned from previous installs how crappy stock HU grounds can be lol. As for processing I was just looking for something that would allow me to better blend my sub stage with my front stage. I'm using my ID component set for my upper mids and highs, Mach 5 MLI's strictly as mids, and obviously the 12" Havoc for the sub stage.

Thanks for the input fellas. I will do some trouble shooting to see about getting rid of the faint whine that comes through. Honestly, it really is not that bad.....if your not listening for it you more than likely will not hear it. However, due to me being somewhat of a perfectionist I am determined to get rid of it completely! On another subject, what is a good signal processor that you would recommend? I see a lot of stuff about Rockford 3Sixty and various Audiocontrol products, but I would like to know what you all think would give me the tuning capability that my navigation unit does not provide.

Well at least you did not have a cap explode and some resistors burn up like I did...........my trunk still has the smell of burnt electrical components, after three weeks.

Last night as I was just listening to the radio as I was driving along and I began to notice an odd smell in my car. My volume was low, and I have not played my music loud in a while. Initially I thought maybe something was just coming through the vents outside. However, when I got home and popped my trunk I was greeted with a haze of white smoke!!!!! I am running two amps; an SAE-1200D and a SAX-50.4. Upon further investigation this morning I checked the impedance of all my speakers and they are what they should be and my voltages are correct at the amp. After letting the trunk air out a little bit I noticed that the smell seemed to be associated with the 1200D and not the 50.4 as a result of actually putting my nose to the amps and smelling them. I'm in a rush to get to class so I will provide more details on my setup later. I was just looking for some quick insight. Thanks, Thomas